Substitute for Ansco 130

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Lyn Arnold, Dec 18, 2007.

  1. Lyn Arnold

    Lyn Arnold Subscriber

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    I've been mixing and using Ansco 130 for a few years and love it for its "look" and keeping qualities as a paper developer. But the combined cost of Glycin and shipping to Australia is getting prohibitive. Can anyone suggest an alternative?

    I prefer to mix my own developers rather than buying proprietary products.

    Thanks in advance

    Lyn
     
  2. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    Ethol's LPD is a fairly long-lasting dev, but I don't know if you can find it there. However, you should be able to find Dektol; lasts fairly well and should be much cheaper than glycin.
     
  3. TheFlyingCamera

    TheFlyingCamera Membership Council Council

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    Dektol won't give you the Ansco 130 look. It also doesn't last nearly as long as 130. Look around and see if you can find the Ilford Warmtone pre-mixed liquid. I know it's a proprietary developer, but it is relatively economical, and if the Ilford importer in Australia brings it in, it should be readily available.
     
  4. PhotoJim

    PhotoJim Member

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    Nothing is really like Ansco 130, unfortunately.

    Perhaps ordering larger quantities of glycin and mixing up larger quantities of stock solution (which keep for a very long time) will be your answer. I've also read that many people have had good luck freezing glycin, although I personally have not tried this. Supposedly the powder will keep years when frozen.
     
  5. PHOTOTONE

    PHOTOTONE Member

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    I think Ilford has actually discontinued their Warmtone developer.
     
  6. Michel Hardy-Vallée

    Michel Hardy-Vallée Membership Council Council

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    Well, given the keeping properties of Ansco 130, you could make a bigger order to amortize costs?

    Otherwise, I found that PolymaxT is a pretty decent substitute, and has a slight edge over Dektol in terms of look. It's a commercial product, but it might be easier to find.

    You might want to have a look at the recipes in here:
    http://www.jackspcs.com/pdev.htm

    Or invest in The Darkroom Cookbook, which has quite a few formulae as well. The authors' explanations should help to guide you.
     
  7. dpurdy

    dpurdy Member

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    According to my first tests with Ansco 130 (which I liked quite a lot) the biggest difference is in print color. It gave me very warm prints with good contrast. It was warmer than anything I have been able to mix up but you might try mixing a developer with a lot of potas Bromide and not much sodium Carbonate.

    If you are mixing from scratch as opposed to a box mix the Ansco 130 isn't all that expensive in the greater scheme of things.
    Dennis
     
  8. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

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    Far as I know, the only one they discontinued was the cooltone developer.

     
  9. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

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    A developer I always liked, but that almost requires a selenium toning session afterwards (unless you like a green cast) is Ilford Bromophen.
    I have used it diluted to 1+3 and have had good results from it. It's sold in powder form so shipping should be reasonable. It works really well with Kentmere Kentona paper and Ilford Warmtone.
    I can't say that it's precisely like A-130, but it does display a really nice tonal scale, and its keeping properties was good in my darkroom. I used the same concentrate, stored in a glass bottle, for almost a year without any noticeable change.

    - Thomas

     
  10. TheFlyingCamera

    TheFlyingCamera Membership Council Council

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    Cooltone was the discontinued product, not Warmtone.
     
  11. eclarke

    eclarke Member

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    Has anyone tinkered with putting their Glycin in solution to maintain longevity? I use about 1# every 5-6 months so have not had any problems with the stuff from Formulary....EC
     
  12. DeBone 75

    DeBone 75 Member

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    I too like 130 but my Glycin is old and brown and can't afford any new. It still works but I try to save it for special times. So I also was looking around. I was reading a post on Salvich Bromide. While reading the artical I saw he ( Liam Lawless) had a warmtone dev. I tryed it, and with some tweeking and playing I came very close to the 130 look. I upped the bromide slightly and I did not put the carbonate in until I mix the working. At a dilution of 1:12 I get a nice warm but not brown print. I dev. this for 3 min. My paper is Arista II. I have not tryed it on other papers yet. I will try it with Varycon. Here is the url http://www.ex-obscurum.com/slavich.htm. The dev. formula is about a third the way done.
     
  13. Tom Hoskinson

    Tom Hoskinson Member

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    Yes, I have posted on that topic here on APUG. I disolved the Glycin in TEA (Triethanolamine). Worked fine.
     
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  15. Tom Hoskinson

    Tom Hoskinson Member

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    I have used Ilford ID-78 with excellent results (I mix it from scratch and add more Potassium Bromide). Ian Grant posted the ID-78 recipe in the APUG recipes section a long time ago - but it has since disappeared.
     
  16. ongarine

    ongarine Member

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    Here the ID-78 formula:
    ID-78

    750 ml. water
    50 grams Sodium sulfite anidro
    62 grammi Sodium carbonate anidro
    12 grammi Idrochinon
    0.50 grammi Phenidone in 20 ml. alcool
    *4.5 grammi Potassium Bromide

    Diluition 1+1 water 1 minute developing time at 20 C.
    Diluition 1+3 water 2 minutes tdeveloping time at 20 C.
    * you can add until 10 grams of Potassium Bromide to increase warm tones
    For all the lovers of warm tones paper developer here there is a tab in French with interesting paper developers.
     

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  17. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    There is also Kodak's DK-93. From Anchell's Darkroom Cookbook:

    p-aminiphenol HCl 5 grams
    Sod. Sulfite 30g
    HQ 2.5g
    Sod. Metaborate 20g
    Pot. Bro. .5g

    For warm tones on paper, use w/o dilution dev for 2 min. For colder tones, 2x the Sod. Metabortate and dev for 1-2 min.

    You can also use this dev for film.

    I included this dev as it may use more readily available chems.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2007
  18. Tom Hoskinson

    Tom Hoskinson Member

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    I've mixed this one too (from Kodak's published recipe that I posted on Apug a while back - now it's gone). I found it an interesting and useful developer.

    The Hydroquinone and Phenidone in ID-78 are readily available - as are the Potassium Bromide, Sodium Sulfite and Sodium Carbonate.
     
  19. eclarke

    eclarke Member

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    Hi Tom,
    What kind of solution?...Evan Clarke
     
  20. eclarke

    eclarke Member

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    Tom,
    I found a previous post about Ansco 130 and it was a response to me. Have you done just Glycin in TEA? I use glycin in a couple formulas...EC
     
  21. Lyn Arnold

    Lyn Arnold Subscriber

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    Thank you one and all for your responses. APUG is such a wonderful source of photographic experience and wisdom.

    I'll give the Kodak DK-93 and the ID-78 a try. I have Anchell's publication.

    Greetings for the festive season -- it's getting hot here, but good beach weather!

    Lyn
     
  22. JBrunner

    JBrunner Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    The suggestions of other developers are good, but none will "substitute" for 130. It's about the glycin. The suggestions for ordering glycin in a large amount and mixing and keeping it in solution to preserve it are the best ones, if you are truly looking for 130 like properties.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 18, 2007
  23. dpurdy

    dpurdy Member

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    Just to chime in on Glycin, I just ordered via telephone from Photographer's Formulary today a Pound of Glycin which cost 80 USD. Compared to Hydroquinone that is a lot of money. But if you figure you use a liter of working solution and you only use 5 grams of Glycin that means it costs something around a dollar a batch for the Glycin which isn't enough to worry about too much but then the issue is definitely storage if you want to keep it bright and fresh. However I just tried it out last week with Glycin that was stored room temp in a drawer for something like 2.5 years and it was a light brown color but worked fine.

    PS Also right now at Photographers Formulary they have free shipping for a pound of Glycin.
     
  24. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

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    Oh dear, Christmas in bathing suits? What is the world coming to? :smile:
     
  25. ronlamarsh

    ronlamarsh Member

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    Ansco 130

    I don't know if "brown "glycin means itsd bad but photographers formulary in Montana(usa) has their own 130 developer pre-packaged in a box at a very fair price. I don't know if its any easier to get into Australia though.
     
  26. Lyn Arnold

    Lyn Arnold Subscriber

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    Looks as though I will have to 'bite the bullet' and order more Glycin. Last time the shipping charge was more than one third of the total cost for just 100 grams. I'll order a larger amount this time.

    Thanks all