Superia 400 in id-11

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by pierods, Dec 16, 2008.

  1. pierods

    pierods Member

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    Somebody has a recipe for color film in id-11?

    I suspect since all color films are developed in c-41, they also share the same recipe for developing in b/w.

    Times? temperatures? fix? stop? wash?

    thanks.

    piero
     
  2. Lopaka

    Lopaka Member

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    I've done C-41 film in B&W developer - I have no idea the time, I did develop by inspection. Stop, fix and wash pretty much the same as for B&W films. You get a B&W image with an orange mask. The results are printable, but less than stellar.

    Bob
     
  3. 2F/2F

    2F/2F Member

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    What result do you hope to obtain?

    If what you want is a "normal" looking black and white picture from something you have shot on color neg film, you are better off just developing your film in C-41 chemistry and making the print black and white via a number of methods, the "best" of which is probably scanning. If you want to print your color negs on b/w paper for sure, ask the lab to push your film at least one stop to make printing easier.

    If you want a special effect, just have at it and experiment. Then let us know what you did, and what you got.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2008
  4. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    You're being charitable. I've done it too. I suspect we all have. IIRC it was about 10 minutes at 75F in D-76 1+1. Results were pretty bad, and I never bothered to print any of the negatives.
     
  5. Palantiri7

    Palantiri7 Member

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    Well I once accidentally processed an 8x10 E100VS transparency in Pyrocat and got the attached.
     

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  6. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    That's E6, not C-41. Different game.
     
  7. Palantiri7

    Palantiri7 Member

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    Quite so.
     
  8. pierods

    pierods Member

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    So you guys advise to use slide film for that?
     
  9. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Given the results, I'm surprised you only did it once.

    Matt
     
  10. mabman

    mabman Member

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    Additionally there is a Kodak tech publication that describes a mild bleaching solution with (I believe) Farmer's Reducer and citric acid that they say will dissolve the dye couplers in colour films after development in standard B&W chems. (The orange mask I think is permanent regardless.)

    Unfortunately it's no longer available online - I requested a copy some time ago, and they were more than happy to mail a hard copy to me. It's at home right now and I'm not, so I don't have the details.

    I believe it's been mentioned here before, and PE expressed his doubts about the viability of the procedure, but I can't find the thread now. If I can find it later I'll post more details...
     
  11. pierods

    pierods Member

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    Well, I scan so the masks are not a problem for me. Would you remember what developers/times did the publication recommend?
     
  12. mabman

    mabman Member

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    As I recall it doesn't recommend a specific b&w developer, it is more geared to what can you do if you've developed this film in *any* b&w developer by mistake.

    Point of interest, though, you can probably use stand development and develop it to completion - I like Rodinal 1:200 for 2 hours (agititate first minute, let stand for remainder).
     
  13. mabman

    mabman Member

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    OK, my memory failed me a bit - Kodak actually advises to print colour negatives developed in black and white chems as normal, and to not do anything else. They do, however, indicate you can "remove the stain from Kodachrome and Ektachrome films" by making a bleach and processing as follows (for posterity, as this isn't exactly the original question, and I have no idea if this will work at all on colour neg films as I haven't tried it myself). Taken from Kodak publication no: AE-31, published April 1999 (summarizing):

    1. Prepare a bleach bath:
    - dissolve 1 ounce (28 g) citric acid in 1 gallon (4L) rapid fixer solution (regular manufacturer's strength for fixing films)

    2. Treat the negative(s) in Photo-Flo solution (regular recommended strength) at 75-80 deg. F (24-27 deg. C) for 1 minute.

    3. Rinse in water at the same temp as above for 20 sec.

    4. Immerse in bleach bath at the same temp as above for 7-14 min. (note: there is no indication in the document exactly when it should be removed - however, the implication is this process removes stain, so my assumption is remove it when the stain is gone. Also, there is no mention of any agitation.). Stop this process if reduction of the silver itself is apparent.

    5. Wash the negative(s) thoroughly at the same temp as above.

    6. Dry negative(s), remove excess water.

    This might be interesting to try on colour neg films just to see what happens.
     
  14. tiberiustibz

    tiberiustibz Member

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    The stain is the yellow filter which is a type of silver. By bleaching the negative you will also be losing shadow detail in the negative. You know they do make b+w film? You seem to be hunting for a way to process color film in b+w chemistry. Why? It has a tendency to get really ugly.
     
  15. pierods

    pierods Member

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    thanks!
     
  16. pierods

    pierods Member

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    By that token, I should also only use tab grain film, since it's more fine grained, and better yet, switch to digital.:rolleyes:
     
  17. fschifano

    fschifano Member

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    ...and the logic behind that last statement is? Sorry, I don't get it. T-grain and conventional grain films are like first cousins to each other. The have more in common than they have differences. C-41 is very unlike any standard B&W film, more like a relative by marriage.