Toning problem?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Blighty, Apr 30, 2009.

  1. Blighty

    Blighty Subscriber

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    Fellow Apuggers,
    I recently made a print on Ilford Multigrade RC and decided to (partially) tone it using Thiocarbamide. When it came to washing it, I noticed there was a sort of 'bloom' on the normally very glossy print surface. Thorough washing removed some but not all of this. A quick soak in HCA didn't help. I tried very gently wiping the surface with a soft cloth which, when the print dried, left an uneven finish with visible wipe marks. This bloom isn't visible when viewing the print directly from the front and, in fact, I posted the print in the standard gallery. But when it catches the light at certain angles it looks rather ugly. I didn't want to overwash the print as it had already started to delaminate at the edges. I don't recall ever having had this problem with FB paper. Any thoughts? Regards, B.
     
  2. Robert Hall

    Robert Hall Subscriber

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    What was your total wet time for this particular image? Have you reproduced the problem on subsequent prints?
     
  3. Blighty

    Blighty Subscriber

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    I never made a total wet time, but as a guess I'd say around 20~25 mins (this includes dev, stop, fix, wash, bleach, tone and rewash, plus a little extra time in warmish water to ensure the highlights didn't degrade in the bleach). I had the same problem with two other prints I made.
     
  4. thmm

    thmm Member

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    To quote from Wolfgang Moersch's sulphide toning article http://www.moersch-photochemie.de/content/artikel/anleitungen/113 (my translation):
    "All thiourea toners are highly alkaline! [...] If a print remains in a highly alkaline bath for a long time [...], the gelatin may soften, causing the surface to appear dull after drying. Therefore, the toning time should in no case be longer than one minute. Some highly hardened papers may survive a few minutes of toning without any ill effect, other brands are very sensitive, especially if the paper is fresh out of the factory. If surface problems occur even at short toning times, drying before further processing might help, otherwise the gelatin has to be hardened before the toning step."

    Hardening fixers should do for the last suggestion I guess, however hardening has its own set of disadvantages. Maybe the print was just souped in the toner for too long?
     
  5. tim rudman

    tim rudman Member

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    Blighty, try a soak in 3% acetic acid. or dilute stop bath.
    Tim
     
  6. Roger Pellegrini

    Roger Pellegrini Subscriber

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    Did you use a hardener after toning?
     
  7. Blighty

    Blighty Subscriber

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    No, I've never used hardener at any stage during the printing/toning process.
    I might very well try that. But thanks everybody for your input. Regards, B.
     
  8. PVia

    PVia Member

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    Follow Mr Rudman's advice, in fact, I believe I read it in his printing and/or toning book a few years ago. You can use a weak non-indicator stop bath if that's all you have handy as well. This week I used approx one tablespoon of citric acid in 1 liter of water and soaked the thio-toned prints for a minute or two. To my knowledge, this can be done safely as part of the wet cycle or after drying.