Using Nelson Gold Toner

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by Lee Shively, Oct 23, 2004.

  1. Lee Shively

    Lee Shively Member

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    I 've been playing with Nelson gold toner and Ilford Warmtone FB paper. I know it's a PITA--10 minutes at 110 degrees F with constant agitation gets old. But I absolutely love the way the prints look. After I started using the toner, I read that this was part of Paul Strand's normal process. Maybe I'm onto something here.

    I've bought up a wide selection of warm tone papers to try out. I've never used any of them before so it's all new to me. Has anyone here used any of these warmtone variable contrast papers with with Nelson gold: Bergger (both the ivory and the regular base), Cachet, Forte (ivory and regular), Flexicon and Oriental?

    If you have any experience with these papers in Nelson gold, give me some opinions. My print developers are Dektol and LPD. The LPD is usually diluted 1:4 or 1:3.
     
  2. dancqu

    dancqu Member

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    I've read that Nelson's Gold Toner works as well at room temperature
    as 110F. Allow more time and agitate every few minutes.

    I've all the chemistry for Nelson's and hope to be working with it in a
    few weeks. Dan
     
  3. donbga

    donbga Member

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    I've used Nelson Gold Toner with LPD wil Ilford MG and MG warmtone. It can yield tones that are quite nice (not a good description). I think it adds depth to your prints and a warm sepia tone that is unique. The key is experiment. I've only used it hot but don't heat it in a microwave, if you do the toner will never work again. I learned this the hard way.

    Good Luck,

    Don Bryant
     
  4. mark

    mark Member

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    WOuld it be possible for someone to post a before toning and after toning print? I would really like to see the difference.
     
  5. ann

    ann Subscriber

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    Be sure you use a fixer with hardner after toning.
    We have always used it warm, put a stainless steel tray on a hot plate. fill with water and put another plastic tray into the water with the toner.

    It will work much better with the warm tone papers than with the colder tones, especially if you are looking for a serious shift in color. It will also split tone.


    Check Jonathan Bailey's web site for some examples.

    I am out of town and do not have any prints with me.

    Another great toner for these papers would be Hypo-Alum .
     
  6. Alan Davenport

    Alan Davenport Member

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    Mixing Nelson Gold Toner

    Recently, I made up 2 liters of Nelson Gold Toner. I followed the instructions carefully. However, the sediment that formed after the addition of the Gold Chloride which the instructions said may continue for several days to a week never stopped. Even after more that 2 weeks a very yellowish sediment continued to settle and cling to the sides and bottom of the glass jug.

    What caused this? Also, the milkiness that formed during the mixing of the Ammonium Persulfate and the Hypo turned into a yellowish sediment. The water I used was at 125deg F, was this temperature too high. Does this sediment need to be filtered out before adding the Gold Chloride solution?

    Thanks
    Alan Davenport
     
  7. donbga

    donbga Member

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    The sediment is normal. When you use the toner you can filter it before pouring it into the tray but return it to the storage bottle. I don't understand the chemical reactions involved but your observation and experience is normal for this toner.

    I'm not sure that I can endorse using the toner in a stainless steel tray since there are various grades of stainless, meaning not all are non reactive. Instead I would recommend heating in a pyrex container and pouring it in to a flat bottomed plastic tray surroundef by a hot water bath in another tray. Aim for a temperature of about 105F. This toner is a hassle to use but can yield extremely rewarding results. You may wish to experiment with split toning pulling the print before the toning is complete. Also you can tone shortly in Nelson Gold toner followed by a lengthy wash which you can then follow with a toning bath of selenium toner or blue gold toner. Selenium toner will turn the print a reddish copper hue and the blue gold toner will cause a cool split tone in the print.

    Tim Rudman's Master Toning handbook is an excellent reference to guide you in your toning experiments.

    Good luck, have fun, and take a lot of notes,

    Don
     
  8. ann

    ann Subscriber

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    I wouldn't recommend stainsteel trays for any toners. They have reactions to many of the various chemcials used in toners. In fact, we just use the stainless trays for warming baths and don't use them with the standard developers, etc; and this is with photograde stainless steel trays.

    This is a great toner and like all of the more exotic toners has a mind of it's own, with the results being unpredictable especially when allowing the print to split. Toning to completion is pretty straight forward.

    I will second donbga recommendation about Time Rudman's book as a reference guide.
     
  9. Mark Layne

    Mark Layne Member

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    Polymax

    One paper we seem to miss is Polymax C surface. It's light cream base is delightful and it has enough gloss to hold out a good black. I guess it was designed as a replacement for Ektalure. Tones beautifully in gold.