Water spots on film?

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by ToddB, Dec 27, 2012.

  1. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Hey guys,

    how do get off water water spots off a negative? I re-rinsed the neg in photo-flo solution and then when it dries, I have a few annoying water spots. Is it possible I need to make up another batch of photo-flo? I've had this batch for a while.

    ToddB
     
  2. Terry Christian

    Terry Christian Subscriber

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    Just moisten the corner of a sponge with diluted Photo-Flo and gently wipe the spots. They'll come right off.
     
  3. mfohl

    mfohl Subscriber

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    My final film wash is in distilled water. I haven't had any spots for a long time.
     
  4. TBN

    TBN Member

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    Same here - but I use demineralised water instead.
     
  5. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Great tips guys.. Murphy's law.. this negative has a beautiful image on it and accidently touched it and put a slight finger print on it and this happened. I'll try it tonight keep you posted.This is first time this has happened too. I have a filter system installed to help.

    Todd
     
  6. iulian

    iulian Member

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    My water supply has plenty of limestone in it, so I use distilled water with Photo-Flo (the Ilford version, 1:200 dilution). Everything is spotless :smile: Don't touch the film, don't wipe the retained water. Let it drain a bit while on the spool, hang it to dry and come back in a few hours.
     
  7. artonpaper

    artonpaper Subscriber

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    If I get water spots, and I seldom do, since I mix fresh photo flo for each session, one half the recommended strength -- I just breathe on the negative to be printed and immediately wipe it with a clean anti static cloth. Works like a charm. All my students use that technique now, too.
     
  8. cliveh

    cliveh Subscriber

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    The tendency for water spots to appear (calcium carbonate deposits), will depend a lot on where you live and your relative hardness or softness of water supply. But after washing negs in cold tap water, I dunk the spiral containing negs in deionised water for about 30 seconds (twizzle about) and then hang them to dry. I never get water spots. However, if you do, all you need to do after cutting them into strips when dry, is put them emulsion side down on something clean like a negative page (shiny side up) and breath on them like you are misting up a mirror and then wipe the shiny side with a soft lens cloth (drying marks only form on the shiny side of the film) and this should get rid of them. If they are still there, dab a little ethanol on the soft cloth and wipe them again. This should get rid of any drying marks (water spots).
     
  9. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    How about lens tissue? Or can use that material you use to wipe Ipad screen? These cut down negs too.


    ToddB
     
  10. cliveh

    cliveh Subscriber

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    The cloth from a spectacle case is fine.
     
  11. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Got those for my reading glasses. sweet.

    ToddB
     
  12. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    So..do you think I'm OK with fogging neg up with breath and just wiping down glasses cloth? Or should I go throught the process of dip and dunk with distilled water, photo-flo, and then dry?

    Todd
     
  13. cliveh

    cliveh Subscriber

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    OK with breath and wipe, which should solve the problem.
     
  14. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Great.. I love the idea about adding distilled water rinse in the final stages of film devloping. I'll be doing that on the next roll.

    ToddB
     
  15. Dan Henderson

    Dan Henderson Member

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    I learned to keep a Tupperware (or similar) container full of distilled water. After a batch of negatives is washed in water, I put a capful of isopropyl alcohol and 1 drop of Photo Flo in the water, stir, and rinse the negs before hanging to dry. No water spots, few dust spots as long as I get out of the darkroom and let the film dry. I reuse the same water over and over again, adding new alcohol and Photo Flo each time. The alcohol helps the water evaporate from the film more quickly, and I think also keeps mutant life forms from growing in the Photo-Flo enriched water.
     
  16. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    How oz of water in Tupperware. I mixed photo-flo as directed on bottle for a gallon.

    Todd
     
  17. Alessandro Serrao

    Alessandro Serrao Member

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    I use photo-flo one-shot and follow religiously the manufacturer indications, using distilled water.
    I've never had a single problem that way.
     
  18. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Update.. I landed up making up a new batch of photo-flo. Film still drying but looks good. What a pain.

    Toddb
     
  19. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Why do you make up batches of photo-flo?

    It is far more prudent to use photo-flo for a day and then dump it.

    Photo-flo is incredibly cheap and used, working strength photo-flo is a great environment to grow mould.
     
  20. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Great question.. Thats the way I was taught.. I guess I could entertain the idea of doing it more effciantly. Explain your process? I have a Petersan two reel tank doing 120. How does your reciepe work? Oz, eye dropper water.. ect?

    Todd
     
  21. Rick A

    Rick A Subscriber

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    Clean the neg with a cotton swab moistened with 91% isopropyl alcohol.
     
  22. Rick A

    Rick A Subscriber

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    I use a similar method. I use one drop of Edwal LFN per 16oz distilled water plus one capfull of 91% isopropyl alcohol. I never get spots on my film and it dries in minutes. I still allow overnight drying, or at least a few hours, for the emulsion to harden properly to avoid scratching.
     
  23. ToddB

    ToddB Member

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    Can some one tell me that Photo-flo recipe shakes out in lamens terms? Meaning oz of water to Photo-flo.

    Todd
     
  24. Terry Christian

    Terry Christian Subscriber

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    There's no recipe, really, Todd. The bottle says to dilute 1:200, but many of us find that to be too much. I use about two drops of Photo-Flo per reel of film in the developing tank.
     
  25. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

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    Lets say you normally use 20 ounces of working solution. That is equivalent to about 640 ml.

    So that means about 1/10 ounce of concentrate (3 ml) diluted to 20 ounces (640 ml).

    In order to "calibrate" your dispensing system, take an eye-dropper or bottle with a drop dispenser and use it to count how many drops of the Photo-flo are needed to dispense 1 ounce (32 ml). If the answer is 30, you know that you need 3 drops to dispense 1/10 ounce (3 ml).

    You can pour the 1 ounce back into the initial bottle.

    Like many here, I find 1:200 to be more concentrated than necessary, so I would suggest that if your calibration suggests 3 drops per 200 ml, start with 2 drops first.

    Be sure to mix it well - I like to put the concentrate into a small amount of water, and then dilute it to my target volume.

    There are two further things I've found helpful.

    1) A small (4 ounce?) bottle with an eye dropper incorporated in a re-closable cap is very handy - just dispense the Photo-flo concentrate into that first. Remember that you will have to calibrate it as well, as the dropper may dispense larger or smaller drops; or
    2) Consider making up a "stock" solution of Photo-flo in alcohol.

    For the last couple of years, I have been doing the latter. I have an 8 ounce (250 ml) bottle that I use to mix up a stock solution of 25 ml Photo-flo stock diluted with 70% isopropryl alcohol to 250 ml. For use, I further dilute that stock solution to a working solution by adding 23 parts water to one part stock (usually 25 ml diluted to 600 ml working). This means I end up with a total dilution of about 1:240, which works well with our water.

    It is much easier to measure 25 ml reasonably accurately than it is to measure the concentrate in drops. The alcohol in the stock solution prevents the growth of mould.

    Hope this helps.