what is replenishment?

Discussion in 'Darkroom Equipment' started by game, Sep 1, 2005.

  1. game

    game Member

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    Hello,
    I like to know what replenishment excactly is, and what's there to know about it.
    I am dutch, so I simply don't understand the word "replenishment". Since there is no dutch word for it... I am not getting any furder. :smile:

    So please help me understand.

    Thanks Game
     
  2. David A. Goldfarb

    David A. Goldfarb Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    There is probably someone who speaks Dutch who can just translate it for you, but "replenishment" in the darkroom refers to adding a fresh chemical solution to a used solution to maintain the strength of the solution. Sometimes it may be the same solution, and sometimes it may be a replenisher, which is a little different from the original solution. Usually this method would be used for development in deep tanks or a roller processor, where you would want to reuse the chemicals many times, rather than mixing fresh chemicals for each batch.
     
  3. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

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    Replenishment is removing some of the used chemicals and replacing it with some replenisher. The replenisher might be a different chemical or just the same stuff. Unless you're doing a lot of processing or doing colour I don't think replenishing makes much sense. For B&W I do a lot one shot. Developer is used once and tossed. Fixer and stop I just keep track how much I've used it.
     
  4. Paul Howell

    Paul Howell Member

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    Some old timers replenished D76 and keep tanks going for years, they feel that a "ripened tank" has a softer look with a longer tonal range that they like for landscapes. I have a one gallon jug of Microdol X that I have been replensihed for the past year or so, just because I found a some packets of replensiher real cheap. I think the contrast is increasing some, but I have not tested a roll to see if there are any differences between rolls that were process as one shot and those processed in my current tank. I have started to use Harvey's 777 (Defender 777) and Edwal 12 and the preferred method is to use new developer to replace 1/2 of the old developer at a given point. I have not yet gotten to that point so I dont know what what to expect.
     
  5. c6h6o3

    c6h6o3 Member

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    You need to replenish Harvey's
     
  6. Paul Howell

    Paul Howell Member

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    I dont think I have processed the recommended square inches of film before I do the dumb and add, what do you recommend?
     
  7. game

    game Member

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    ok, I think I have the idea.
    So the fact that the bottles on my printing machine are called replenishment bottles, is because they add some chemicals to the process when needed.
    The waste should be trown away afterwards... (?)
     
  8. c6h6o3

    c6h6o3 Member

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    For a gallon, add 6 oz. every 8 sheets of 8x10 (80 sq. in.). On Ed Buffaloe's Unblinkingeye site there's a replenishment chart for 777 in the article by Fred DeVan.
     
  9. Bob F.

    Bob F. Member

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    That sounds correct. However, you really need the manual for your machine which should explain all. Perhaps someone here will be familiar with that specific machine if you tell us its make and model.

    Cheers, Bob.
     
  10. David H. Bebbington

    David H. Bebbington Inactive

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    Don't speak Dutch, but in German "replenish" is "regenerieren" and "replenisher" is "Regenerat" - does this help?
     
  11. argus

    argus Member

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  12. John Cook

    John Cook Member

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    Adding replinisher to a developer will extend its capacity. But not indefinitely. In the case of D76 used with replenishment, Kodak recommends dumping the developer after 9600 square inches of film per gallon have been processed.

    Some replenishers require prior removal of an equal amount of old developer before adding to the tank. Others are sufficiently concentrated and so little is required that they simply replace the developer which was carried out on wet film in normal processing. Manufacturer's instruction sheets will give directions to follow.

    Some developers are replenished with a special replenisher which contains concentrated chemicals which are depleted in development. Other developers are replenished with new developer instead.

    The amount of replenisher to use is determined by the amount of silver which is developed. This, in turn, is calculated by the number of films developed, the exposure and the tonality of the subject matter. Obviously, high-density negatives exhaust the developer more quickly than thin negatives. Calculating replenishment solely on the basis of films run will inevitably lead to big errors over time, making the developer much to active or much to weak.

    For this reason, labs which replenish also develop pre-exposed test strips of film from the manufacturer, which are read using a densitometer to check the developer activity level. The amount of replenisher added is determined by these density readings. A lot of extra work over simply diluting developer and using in the "one shot" method.

    Unfortunately, some machines and some developers require replenishment.

    Here is technical information on replenishing D76 from Kodak:

    http://www.kodak.com/global/en/prof...78/j78.jhtml?id=0.1.16.14.32.14.7.14.14&lc=en
     
  13. game

    game Member

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    Thanks everyone for explaining. It was not a problem with understanding english, just that the word "replenishment" was never explained to me. In what language it gets explained does not matter to me. (as long as you guys understand my undoubtly failing english :smile: )

    I have the feeling replenishing means two things:

    1. In my machine (agfa curix60) it means that fresh chemicals I already mixed are added to the tank in which my paper is. Replenish means not much more than "adding to the process".

    2. When developping by hand it means something else. In that case there is some sort of chemical different from the develloper that can be add to the develloper to make it fresh again.

    Hope the way I desribed it above is the way it is the way it is.
    Please correct my in spots where I am wrong.

    Think I'm close to nailing it :smile:
    Thanks greetings GAME
     
  14. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

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    Replenisher is going to be the same either by machine or by hand. Some times it is a different formula. Other times it isn't. The stuff I use for C-41 bleach just uses undiluted bleach for the replenisher. When you make a fresh tank you dilute it. When you replenish it it's used undiluted.

    Different chemicals will use different things for replenisher. They will also have different rates. You need to check the info for your chemicals.
     
  15. game

    game Member

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    Ok,

    a. So the bottle on my machine were develloper goes in, is called replenishertank cause it add chemical to the process.

    b. Some chemicals are one-shots, so I trow them away after they have gone trough the machine and have ended up in the waist cans.

    Other chemicals can be revived in one way or another and in some cases with a chemical that is called replenisher.
    Those chemicals can go right into the tanks for another round in the machine after replenisher has been added cause they are fresh again.

    Better?

    Thanks, please be patient with me. GAME
     
  16. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

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    It's called a replenisher tank because it holds replenisher-) Nothing more complicated then that.

    You really should check the manuals for your chemicals and machine. If you are going to use replenishment you need to make sure you aren't using too little or too much.

    Are you sure the waste cans are waste cans? They might be recovery tanks.
     
  17. game

    game Member

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    hi nick, thanks for responding!

    The thing that is confusing for me is that there are three tanks.
    one for develloper. one for fixation. one for water.
    All those tanks are called replenisher tanks in the manual. Not cause they hold replenisher, but because they add liquids to the process.
    So if you use replenisher where should it go? All three tanks are already in use.
    (the waste tanks indeed are waste tanks)

    Game
     
  18. Nick Zentena

    Nick Zentena Member

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    All three tanks are likely replenishment tanks for the three steps. Developer replenisher in one tank. This tank should feed into the developer. Fix replenisher which should feed into the fix tank. Water I guess for the other tank.

    Which process are you doing? Which chemicals?
     
  19. game

    game Member

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    I still have to decide on the chemicals, but likely the prcoess will be RA4.
    I don't know if the picture you have is right... I am still discovering the machine. But the manual will not help me ot in this area.
    I emailed the previous owner. Hope he can sort stuff out.
     
  20. Petzi

    Petzi Member

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    "Replenish" apparently comes from the Latin language. The Latin word "plenus" means "full". So "replenish" means: "refill". :smile:
     
  21. Curt

    Curt Subscriber

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    That's when you top off your coffee cup.
     
  22. Fotohuis

    Fotohuis Member

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    Als het gaat om een kleine doorloopmachine heeft het regenereren met een RA-4 proces niet zoveel zin.
    Kleine ACP (Thermaphot), Durst (RCP) en printo en vergelijkende machines gaan erg goed met Amaloco rapidocolor (30-37 graden) of zelfs de RA-4 monocolor bij verlaagde temperatuur (20-27 graden).

    De stabiliteit van de laatste is erg goed kwa levensduur, geeft alleen vrij veel teeruitval. Regeneratie heeft alleen zin bij grotere machines die constant draaaien.

    Groetjes,

    Robert