What Jobo drum for the 8x20 negative?

Discussion in 'Ultra Large Format Cameras and Accessories' started by JosBurke, Jun 12, 2006.

  1. JosBurke

    JosBurke Member

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    I have a CPP2 and use Expert drums for 4x5, 5x7, and 8x0--I also process my 11x14 film in a Jobo print drum and like my system/ method. My question !! To process an 8x20 negative what drum do I need to locate---I'm not looking for the one that takes the special insert for that film size but rather I think the print drums do fine--I used a Beseler color drum with 7x17 but if something works on the Jobo then I'd prefer the temp control and use of the Jobo. Suggestions!! User feedback !! i've got my 8x20, film and my 355 G Claron and i'm ready but processing is an issue--I've never tray processed sheet film and 8x20 is a big schlong sheet!!
    josburke@bellsouth.net
     
  2. P. Yee

    P. Yee Member

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    If you have the Expert drum for 8x10 already, you should be able to buy the Jobo drum extension model 2870. That will make make your current drum long enough for 8x20.
     
  3. Jorge

    Jorge Inactive

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    I think expert drum are not compatiblw with the 2000 series. Anyhow, buy the 3063, it is waht most of us doing 12x20 use with the CPP. You can use the lid from one fo the other drums to keep it light tight, I dont like the cup thing.
     
  4. George Losse

    George Losse Member

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    I agree with Jorge. I use the 3063 now. It will hold 1-3 8x20's. I have used a 2850 (?) which will hold two 8x20's. I used the smaller series until about a year ago when a found 3063 for a good price.

    It's easier to use the 3063 if your other drum are also the 3000 series drums. I was having to switch the lift back and forth between the two. Not a big deal, but something I don't have to do anymore.
     
  5. jimgalli

    jimgalli Subscriber

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    Joe, I use the 2850 set. You can do 2 at a time. It also holds 2 7X17's. I use the big 3063 for 2 12X20's but am struggling with "tire tracks". These are areas of extra density on the neg where the 3 piece drum is joined. At each of those joints there are no ribs and the developer 'flows' more there and causes the un-equal density.
     
  6. Oren Grad

    Oren Grad Subscriber

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    I've been using the 3063 to develop three 7x17's at a time. It's still early in the game for me; so far I've run only a few tests of JandC 400 in 7x17. At first the negatives were coming out of the drum with some small patches of dye not cleared; soaking in a tray of Perma Wash fixed that, but I found the Forte emulsion to be vulnerable to scratches in handling. However, adding a Perma Wash step during the Jobo run, immediately after the fix and before the wash, cured that, and the negatives from my last batch looked great right out of the drum.
     
  7. jgjbowen

    jgjbowen Member

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    Those of you that use the 3063 for 7x17 negatives....do you just put the negatives in the drum, or do you have some additional hardware that holds the 7x17 film securely in the drum?
     
  8. jonw

    jonw Member

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    For those who use the 3063 or 2870 Jobo Drums for ULF films, e.g., 11x14, do you use a jobo clip pin with it? If not, do you do anthing special in lifting the sheet film away from the drum wall?
     
  9. aria1117

    aria1117 Member

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    I have the same question. I have been using 3005 for 8x10 but is moving to larger negatives (8x20). I have the 3063 but how to keep film in place?

    Thanks!

    Jim
     
  10. George Losse

    George Losse Member

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    Inside the 3063 drum there are a series of ridges. Two sets have ridges and one set has three.

    Start with the set that has three and place the first 8x20 against the middle ridge. It will fit into the next set of ridges, then start the next negative against the other side of where the first one ended. Do the same thing a third time and you can place three 8x20 into the drum. I have not had any move from their spots during processing and I do not place any of the jobo clips over the film on the ridges.

    I have seen the density build-up between the gaps in the ridges where the chemicals flow faster then they do over the ridges. I thought about adding some plastic to continue the ridges but chose to slow down the processor instead.
     
  11. Hugo Zhang

    Hugo Zhang Member

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    I have used Jobo 2850 drum like Jim with very good result. Make sure to get and cut a sheet of rubber or plastic as an insert or liner to put inside the drum. Otherwise your nagetives will get scratches from the ridges inside the drum.

    I dare not to put two loose 8x20 sheets inside the drum. I do one sheet at a time.
     
  12. Donsta

    Donsta Member

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    The 2850 works fine. If you use a 3063 drum with a pyro developer without an insert of some sort, you are looking for trouble. I have negs which you can't see any banding on (from the "gaps" in the ridges of a 3063 where the join is) - however, you can measure it with a UV densitometer and the banding prints with UV processes (not with silver though). If you are lucky enough to find them, the Jobo sheet film inserts which are no longer made work very well for the larger ULF sizes.
     
  13. jonw

    jonw Member

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    Thanks for everyone's insights.

    Having the 2850 Drum, I am looking foward to trying it with 11x14 sheet film. Not having any blank/exposed 11x14 sheet film....and definitely not good at geometry..math..Can you safely place 2 sheets of 11x14 sheet film in the 2850 Drum? How much solution do you use in it? The JOBO instructions for this size drum indicates 400ml of solution per sheet. How much solution do you find works for 11x14 sheet film in the 2850 Drum? Thank you for your time and assistance. Jon
     
  14. Hugo Zhang

    Hugo Zhang Member

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    Can you put 2 sheets of 11x14 in 2850? I don't think so. That drum is for one sheet of 16x20.

    I have learned a lesson in a hard way a year ago. I was begging one of my female friends to model for me for months. She demured and finally agreed. She was a beauty. I made 6 exposures of 5x7 using my 30cm Apo-Lanthar lens. Everything went so well. Coming home excited and tired, I got out my Jobo 3005 drum without dinner. Long story short, to save time, I carefully put 2 sheets of 5x7 negative in each slot, foolishly believing they would be OK since they took less space than one sheet of 8x10. I put one sheet of 8x10 in each of the two remaining slots. All the 6 sheets of 5x7 got ruined in different degrees. They moved within the slots and stacked up on each other. I had some special effect on each sheet! I have not got chance to go back to that girl again. Her beauty has faded or my mood has changed.

    So don't take the short cut.
     
  15. jimgalli

    jimgalli Subscriber

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    Interesting that this got revived. OREN are you there? I'd love to hear how the 3 7X17's are doing in the 3063. I eventually gave up on 2 12X20's in a 3063 tank. No matter what I tried, I got the tire tracks. 11X14 is a conundrum. You can only do one at a time in the drum, so I have to admit, I've just been doing them in a tray. Which is a bummer! I don't seem to have the dexterity to do stacks of multiples in tray, and only souping one at a time is torture for me. 5 8X10's or 4 7X11's is a lot more my style. Cake and eat it too I guess, as I really love working with the bigger cameras. Expecially 11X14.
     
  16. Jim Noel

    Jim Noel Member

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    Since I recently lucked into a wonderfully kept Korona 7x17 I have been processing the negatives in a 3063 drum. At first I used the little keepers which slide on the ridges but they left shadows of themselves on the edge of the film.
    I now do two negatives at a time with the Jobo set to revolve as slowly as possible. I have noticed no streaking of any kind using this method.
     
  17. Oren Grad

    Oren Grad Subscriber

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    Jim, sorry I somehow missed the continuation of this thread back in April. I think the issue with big sheets in the 3062/3063 is that they're much more vulnerable to uneven development in pyro developers than they are in traditional developers. So far I've not had a problem with D-76.
     
  18. sanking

    sanking Member

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    I used to own a Jobo 3063 drum but did not use it much for processing film because I find the Beseler 16X20 drum to be much more convenient, if you have the spacers which will allow you to process one sheet of 12X20 or two sheets of 7X17 or 8X20.

    There is no question but that the ridges of the drum cane cause banding streaks that will be visible with UV processes with pyro developers, though I don't personally see it in my fillm devleoped in the 16X20 Beseler, and I don't use an insert. To eliminate or minimize the streaking use a pre-soak in the durm of about five minutes, use a fairly dilute solution of the developer, and use a generous amount of developer.

    BTW, there have also been reports of this type of UV banding with traditional developers like D76. Fred Newman of the View Camera Store recommended at one time using a 1:3 or 1:4 dilution of D76 to eliminate the problem. I believe the same rationale applies to pyro type developers.

    Sandy King
     
  19. Oren Grad

    Oren Grad Subscriber

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    Thanks, Sandy, that's an important point. To be clear, I'm not using my negatives for UV processes - for prints on commercial silver papers only.
     
  20. Jim Noel

    Jim Noel Member

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    Oren,
    I still have not had a problem. I pre-soak in 750 ml of water for 5 minutes, and develop Efke 100 in 750 ml of pyrocat hd 1 1/2:1:100. the drum rotates as slowly as possible.

    I will keep looking for streaks and hopefully continue to find none.
    Jim
     
  21. sanking

    sanking Member

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    Good point about very slow rotation. I forgot to mention that as one of the potential remedies for UV banding, along with the pre-soak, use of dilute solutins, and use of generous amount of developer.

    Sandy King
     
  22. garysamson

    garysamson Subscriber

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    I have been using a Jobo 3062 print drum to process 12x20 film in Pyrocat HD
    for platinum / palladium printing with excellent results. This drum is no longer made but may be available on the used market.