Which films with...

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by wogster, Jun 25, 2009.

  1. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Okay folks dawn your flame retardant suits.....

    I am about to pick up some HC110 (either today or tomorrow), of the following films, are there any you would NOT recommend to use with it:

    Ilford FP4, Ilford Delta 100, Kodak Tmax 100, Ilford HP5, Ilford Delta 400, Kodak Tmax 400.

    If you think one of them should NOT be used with HC110, could you please provide a reason.

    Thanks
     
  2. Christopher Walrath

    Christopher Walrath Subscriber

    Messages:
    7,129
    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2005
    Location:
    Two inches to the left
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.167 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102 UP.Link/6.3.0.0.0)

    I can speak for the TMX and TMY. HC110 yields great results for me at Dil B for six minutes. Thirty seconds constant but gentle agitation and two inversions every 30 second afterwards. Processed at 68F 20C. Great contrast for the fineness of grain in those films.
     
  3. Christopher Walrath

    Christopher Walrath Subscriber

    Messages:
    7,129
    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2005
    Location:
    Two inches to the left
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.167 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102 UP.Link/6.3.0.0.0)

    Oh, and that's for 135 and 120 rolls films.
     
  4. Thomas Bertilsson

    Thomas Bertilsson Subscriber

    Messages:
    15,254
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2003
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I'm a firm believer that if you work long and hard enough with a combination of film and developer you can reach good results with any two paired together, unless it's a task specific developer, such as lith developer, etc. You know what I mean.

    The rest is a matter of taste.

    Curious question - why all those films?
     
  5. Jeff Kubach

    Jeff Kubach Member

    Messages:
    6,926
    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2007
    Location:
    Richmond VA.
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    As far as I know HC110 will work with any of the mention films.

    Jeff
     
  6. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

    Messages:
    2,131
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I've only used it with HP-5 and TX, but had good results. Thomas has a great point, you really can achieve the results you after with almost any combo.
     
  7. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

    Messages:
    17,174
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2005
    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    The biggest problem with this sort of enquiry is that your range of films is so wide that fine tuning your development could end up being a long and potentially confusing process.

    For example, an adjustment that works for FP4 might worsen the results from TMax 400.

    I've only used it with the Kodak films on your list, but am happy to confirm that HC110 works well with them.

    Matt
     
  8. John Bragg

    John Bragg Member

    Messages:
    634
    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Location:
    Penwithick,
    Shooter:
    35mm RF
    Should work well with all of the above films and really any monochrome film if you take the time to experiment a little and fine tune. My preference is for Dilution H and minimal agitation. Good luck and enjoy using HC-110.

    John.
     
  9. pgomena

    pgomena Member

    Messages:
    1,386
    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2003
    Location:
    Portland, Or
    What you might find is that for some films is that development times for the popular Dilution B might become very short (5 minutes or less).

    I would suggest trying dilution H over Dilution B. (I believe H is dil. B 1:1 with water, but verify before doing, please.) Great stuff, I used it for years before I became a pyro addict.

    Peter Gomena
     
  10. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Which is why I worded it the way I did. What I was looking for is things like it does horrible grain with this film, or really knocks the stuffing out of the tonality with that film.

    Here is the reasoning, I have used almost exclusively FP4 and HP5 with a little PanF for B&W for a donkeys age. Tried a roll of XP2 and was not impressed.

    I want to try the cubic grain films, so I figure I'll run a roll of FP4 and HP5 to see what the developer is like with films I know, then I'll buy a couple of rolls of each of the others, use them, process them, and see which ones I like.

    Now comes part 2 of my question:

    Are there any other cubic grain films I should add to my list. Not sure what Fuji has available in cubic grain films. I use only 35mm at the moment, I limit my films to those I can get here in Canada, so films that are only available in the US or Europe or Asia are of no use to me, I don't use enough film to warrant the hassle of dealing with customs and exchange.....
     
  11. MattKing

    MattKing Subscriber

    Messages:
    17,174
    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2005
    Location:
    Delta, BC, Canada
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    My favourite film is Plus X - which works very well with HC110.

    Matt
     
  12. Anon Ymous

    Anon Ymous Member

    Messages:
    1,479
    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2008
    Location:
    Greece
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Hello wogster.

    I don't use HC110, but here's some interesting information: Ilfotec HC is more or less the same as Kodak's HC110. By having a look at the datasheets you can have some developing times as a starting point. In any case, you'll need to fine tune your process, but at least you have a basis on which you can build with your own experiments. The datasheet for HC110 is here. Have a look at page 4 and you'll see that the recommended dev time for TMax100 (dil b) is 7 minutes. Now at Ilfotec HC's datasheet (page 7) the recommended time for the same film is 7:30. The 7% difference is probably because Kodak suggests a slightly lower contrast index, compared to Ilford. I don't know for sure, but I think Ilford's times are for CI=0,62, a tad high for my taste. So, these two pdfs combined should give you information for 6 Tgrain films TMax/Delta(100, 400, 3200). Enough for everyone I suppose.
     
  13. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Good point,

    Here is the plan, I know FP4 well and HP5 reasonably well, so processing a roll of each becomes a frame of reference, for the developer. I will then try the others at box speed with recommended times. To see which one (or ones) I like best, thus establishing a base line. Then fine tune from there, I will try something, then compare to the base line, if it's good then I can push a little further, if it's not, I have somewhere to go back to, keeping notes on every roll using masking tape and then pen on the negative sheet.
     
  14. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Just an update, my usual source seems to be out of HC110 at the moment, in fact it's now a special order item, not something I wanted to hear :mad:. I wonder if Darkroom Central will accept mail order, as I am one of the 6 people on the planet who does not have a credit card or paypal.....
     
  15. jim appleyard

    jim appleyard Member

    Messages:
    2,131
    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Most folks will shp C.O.D, but you have to pay the extra cost. Plus, you have to pay UPS when the item gets there or leave a check for them, not something everyone can/wants to do.
     
  16. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    I don't think I ever ordered anything C.O.D. It's very expensive to do that. Not sure that any of the couriers do it anymore either....

    Apparently Darkroom Central will accept an order by email, and will then send an invoice, not sure if they ship the items before the cheque clears or not. Doesn't really matter to me, if the lead time is three days or three weeks right now. I just need to know that I have a supplier, who is in Canada, that isn't going to simply quit selling analogue supplies completely. Which my old supplier seems to be slowly doing, am I annoyed, you bet. I will not name the store as I don't know if that raises the ire of the moderators or not.

    If I know it takes three weeks, then I will simply order more when my inventory is low rather then empty. Thing is, and this is bad for the local store, if I am ordering chemistries and need some film, I'll order that as well, since the additional shipping costs are almost nothing.
     
  17. cmacd123

    cmacd123 Member

    Messages:
    1,495
    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Location:
    Stittsville, Ontario
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Last time I needed HC-110, Henry's in Kanata got it in for me in a week from Toronto. You may have to find one of the "experienced" staff to find one who knows what HC-110 is. Their web code is 411KOD004 if you need it for them to find on their computer. I am sure that Vistek could also get it for you, their web site shows it in stock in their Toronto store and out of stock everywhere else.

    The site shows it as a two Gallon size, but it is actually 16US Fl OZ of concentrate. expect to pay 15-17 dollars CDN
     
  18. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Yeah, Henry's Thornhill, tells me it a special order item now, the main store on Church St, doesn't show as having it. I am kinda wondering if Henry's wants to get out of photography all together, and just sell digital sh...tuff. I don't know, maybe if a few people order it, they will start stocking it again. I may head over and see how long it takes. I wonder, did you have to pay up front?

    They have Blazinal in stock, I may try that instead....
     
  19. fschifano

    fschifano Member

    Messages:
    3,216
    Joined:
    May 12, 2003
    Location:
    Valley Strea
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Here's the way I see it. HC-110, or Ilford's Ilfotec-HC if you prefer, is ok with any of the films you mention. It is not my favorite for tank development of small and medium format films. Development times for "Dilution B," the only dilution ration for which there is, IMO, extensive and reliable data, tend to be rather short and difficult to control. Add to that the fact that D-76 delivers slightly better speed and finer grain, and you can understand why I don't like it that much. For large format sheet films developed in trays though, it's really good. The short development times are welcomed and the little extra grain doesn't matter. The slight speed loss doesn't matter either because I'm not usually out to grab every last bit of speed I can from that format.
     
  20. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Yes, I actually would prefer ID11/D76, except these days I have pretty low volume, maybe a couple of 35mm rolls a month, so I don't want to be throwing away developer that has gone south every few rolls. HC110/Ilfotech HC and Rodinal are the ones that last a long time, The dealer is out, but has Rodinal so I may go with that instead.
     
  21. cmacd123

    cmacd123 Member

    Messages:
    1,495
    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Location:
    Stittsville, Ontario
    Shooter:
    35mm
    It has been a month or so, and at that time they had several in "the warehouse" which I assume is their church street store.

    They have never given me any hastle with asking them to get in stock items in, and did not previously ask me for any deposits. On the other hand I have often made a point of wearing a SLR when I go shopping so they do know me.

    There web site shows it as being "on order with supplier" . They also show stock in the Mississauga store in the Toronto area with a suggestion to call first. Number can be found on the web site. (Ancaster, Kingston, London - North, Mississauga, Nepean, Oakville, Ottawa, Sudbury, Winnipeg - Kenaston, Winnipeg - Regent are the stores it shows having stock.)

    Rodinal/Blazinal is great stuff. I actually had Henry's get me some, and it came marked as Rodinal from A&O I have been on a HC-110 Kick and have not used it yet.

    At about 16.00 CDN, each might be worth it to get one of each.
     
  22. wogster

    wogster Member

    Messages:
    1,267
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Location:
    Bruce Penins
    Shooter:
    35mm
    Right now, I think I'll probably go with the Rodinal and see, if I don't like it, I'll order the HC110.....