Zone VI Brilliant fiber paper???

Discussion in 'B&W: Film, Paper, Chemistry' started by wbryant, Mar 26, 2005.

  1. wbryant

    wbryant Member

    Messages:
    88
    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2004
    Location:
    Hoboken, NJ
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I started using the Zone VI Brilliant variable contrast fiber paper and love it. I love the whites and blacks and the in betweens, and I love the rigidness of the wet paper. (I have had other fiber paper kink the emulsion when wet...) I have also not seen any difference in the wet and dry prints, so I don't have to compensate for drydown I think it is called.

    But, my question is, what do the other APUGgers think of this paper. I haven't seen much written on it.

    Thanks in advance for your comments.
     
  2. John McCallum

    John McCallum Member

    Messages:
    2,410
    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    New Zealand
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Hi WBryant, I love it.
    Excellent paper for a lot of the kind of images I've been doing. Has a nice white base as you say, and gives beautiful rich dark tones.I bought 1/2 doz packets of old stock a while ago, and I can see the end of it coming. Wish I could get more.
    Regards, John.
    My contributions to the current Print Exchange will be on zone vi brilliant.
     
  3. mikewhi

    mikewhi Member

    Messages:
    808
    Joined:
    May 22, 2004
    Location:
    Redmond, WA
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    Quite possibly my favorite all-time paper. I'm working with AZO now, but I always loved Brilliant. I used it mostly in graded emulsions, not the VC. Are you using VC Brilliant? It is very cold neutral black and whites, no greenish balcks like Gallerie. I always preferred it to Seagull, too.

    -Mike
     
  4. hortense

    hortense Member

    Messages:
    612
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Location:
    Riverside, C
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    The old Zone VI paper was OUTSTANDING; Fred Picker cut a deal with a famous (in Europe) printing paper manufacturer (can't recall the name). A few years later, this arrangement fell through. While contuing to use Zone VI paper from Calumet, I determined (or, perhaps, surmised) that this was paper manufactured by Ilford. I now mostly use Kodak Polymax and am quite satified with it. For warm tone I use Ilford MGFB and on occassion Se tone to obtain what ever degree of brown shading I am seeking. For colder tone needs, I use Polymax paper and add some benzotriozole to my D-73 print developer.
     
  5. Neal

    Neal Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,625
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2004
    Location:
    Chicago, Wes
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Dear WBryant,

    I use it regularly, although not exclusively. It has a very good look and tones easily.

    Neal Wydra
     
  6. George Collier

    George Collier Member

    Messages:
    1,064
    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Location:
    Richmond, VA
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I've heard (Fred Picker, I think) that contrast can diminish, even in less than a year, depending on storage conditions, as others have suggested. Like you said, like all B&W photo materials, always test first.
     
  7. payral

    payral Member

    Messages:
    382
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Location:
    France
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    The old Zone VI paper was made by Guilleminot & Boesflung in France and it was a marvellous paper.
    When that company stopped its production it became Bergger with some people from the old company but now Bergger production is made by Forte.
     
  8. Bob Carnie

    Bob Carnie Subscriber

    Messages:
    5,480
    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Location:
    Toronto-Onta
    Shooter:
    Med. Format RF
    I think hortense and payral are correct,
    I used the Fred Picker version and it was a beautiful paper , when it switched to Calumet it was a different paper, now I believe as hortense says it is Ilford.
     
  9. John McCallum

    John McCallum Member

    Messages:
    2,410
    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    New Zealand
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Yes I use VC Mike. Still great stuff.

    Bob is Calumet the only place to obtain zone vi brilliant now, do you know?
     
  10. hortense

    hortense Member

    Messages:
    612
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2004
    Location:
    Riverside, C
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Yes.
     
  11. Jeremy

    Jeremy Member

    Messages:
    2,767
    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2002
    Location:
    Denton, TX
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Is the Zone VI Brilliant currently sold by Calumet the same paper as you are using? I believe it is only sold in 8x10 and 11x14 glossy now.
     
  12. John McCallum

    John McCallum Member

    Messages:
    2,410
    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    New Zealand
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Yes they only seem to advertise those two sizes. Have yet to try their stock (all mine is 16x20 so perhaps different paper? not sure).
    Calumet did not seem to be able to satisfy a question I had regarding delivery charges, so this made it difficult to pursue it with them.
     
  13. Alan Davenport

    Alan Davenport Member

    Messages:
    91
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2003
    Location:
    Portland - O
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Brilliant is the finest enlarging paper I have ever used. I have some in the freezer that is 20 years old! The whites are crisp and clean and the blacks are the blackest next to Azo. In Zone vi developer and KRST it gives beautiful cold tones, and for a warmer tone try Ansco 130 at 1:1.

    Alan
     
  14. Earl Dunbar

    Earl Dunbar Member

    Messages:
    558
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    Location:
    Rochester, N
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    Brilliant was, well ... brilliant

    Many years ago I standardized on Brilliant graded. There were other papers I liked, but I did need a standard, and settled on Brilliant developed in Amidol from Photographers' Formulary, tho' I sometimes used Dektol as well. The paper with Amidol gave me the most satisfactory results. I have not printed in years, so if Brilliant is no longer as it was, then I'll have to go back to the drawing board. I used the original made in France.

    Once I start printing again, I'll probably be paying a lot of attention to Perfection from Fine Art here in Rochester. But if I could fine a big stock of frozen Brilliant, original emulsion....

    Earl
     
  15. Gary Grenell

    Gary Grenell Member

    Messages:
    78
    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2004
    Location:
    Seattle
    Shooter:
    Medium Format
    Brilliant Paper from England


    I just purchased (3/29/05) some Brilliant VC III from Calumet. The box says "Made in England". Certainly, ten years ago when I printed on this paper exclusively, it was not made in England. Is it unbranded Ilford or Kentmore? I really do not know the answer.
     
  16. wildbill

    wildbill Member

    Messages:
    2,851
    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2004
    Location:
    Grand Rapids
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    I used a box of this stuff someone had given me and i loved it. When i recently went to order some 16x20, they said it had been discontinued in that size. A month earlier they had it in stock. It's a great paper and doesn't have the coating that Ilford MGIV has so it takes toner better. The rep said to try Ilford as a replacement alternative.
     
  17. shinn

    shinn Member

    Messages:
    92
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Location:
    Bezerkeley,
    I was recently in the SF Calumett asking about this paper and I only seemed to confuse the man behind the LF counter. I was hoping to try it for lith printing and all he could offer was that it was the "same as ilford" I'm not sure which ilford paper he was referring to and he still seemed confused, so I gave up and picked up some Seagall.

    One more reason this site is such a great resource.

    Happy Days
    Mark
     
  18. shinn

    shinn Member

    Messages:
    92
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2004
    Location:
    Bezerkeley,
    I menat to say Calumet.
     
  19. Les McLean

    Les McLean Subscriber

    Messages:
    1,609
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2002
    Location:
    Northern Eng
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    When the French factory closed down and Zone VI had to find a new supplier they went to Ilford and for a time used MG III and reboxed it but I don't know what the situation is now.
     
  20. stinkjet

    stinkjet Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2005
    Location:
    Chicago
    Shooter:
    4x5 Format
    The situation is and has been, since Fred sold the company, that Brilliant VC is Ilford MGIV1K...double weight gloss. Ilford kept on supplying MGIII for a while, but had to switch to IV around 1997. The Graded paper that everyone loved, including me, was French, then switched to Kentmere, the maker of Luminos papers. That is the absolute skinny on that.

    stinkjet
     
  21. aldevo

    aldevo Member

    Messages:
    895
    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2004
    Location:
    Cambridge, M
    Shooter:
    Multi Format
    What stinkjet has recounted is exactly what I have heard. I'd add to it only that the reason why they couldn't continue supplying MGIII was that Ilford needed to switch the facility's production to graphic arts products. The MGIV1K that was subsequently supplied came from another facility (I believe the surviving Ilford Photo facility).
     
  22. Rlibersky

    Rlibersky Subscriber

    Messages:
    782
    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2005
    Location:
    St Paul MN
    Shooter:
    8x10 Format
    Looking a the price this paper is quite cheap. It might be worth trying. Only 8x10 and 11x14 though.
     
  23. Peter Schrager

    Peter Schrager Subscriber

    Messages:
    2,097
    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2004
    Location:
    fairfield co
    Shooter:
    Large Format
    Zone VI Paper

    I know I had the first VC paper that Zone VI had made for them. It was really nice paper. Unfortunately I had NO clue what I was doing at that time with VC paper and unloaded the entire lot to Midwest Photo. That paper was extremely nice. Have no clue what the new paper is like but is probably worth trying as I would doubt that it is EXACTLY like MGIV-otherwise why would they rebrand it? Report back to us....
    Best, Peter