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Lionel1972
03-22-2012, 09:03 AM
According to what the business experts keep telling us about the demande for film trajectory, it must have reached negative figures years ago that's why we see all those clients returning loads of film rolls to Kodak everyday, lining up in front of their local photo store asking money for their film rolls. You know film demand is always getting down and always will. ;-)

Michael R 1974
03-22-2012, 09:44 AM
Still waiting for the OP to post a reference for the speech/address that started all this hyperventilation.

+1

I'd love to see Kodak stick around. However two posts in this thread really crushed whatever enthusiasm I might have had:

1) The notion that Kodak could do nice things if it freed itself from obligations to former employees

2) Someone made a comparison with "Adox".

I couldn't support Kodak products if they fkd employees over. As for Kodak learning anything from "Adox", I wouldn't go anywhere near Kodak products any longer if Kodak did anything at all the way those companies do. "Kodak" would end up being nothing more than a resurrected brand name pasted on junk in an effort to capitalize on the legacy of the brand.

Brian C. Miller
03-22-2012, 10:23 AM
So far, a Google search reveals this link to Rankia (http://www.rankia.com/foros/bolsa/temas/1062994-kodak-chapter-11-quiebra?page=22), posted today.

As for 8x10 Kodachrome for $50 per sheet, yeah, I would go for a 10-sheet box. But not like a maniac. But it would be nice to get E100G again. (I just wonder if we will see Fuji in 8x10 again.)

zsas
03-22-2012, 10:34 AM
The meeting looks legit
http://www.smpte.org/sections/hollywood/events/hollywood-section-meeting-march-20-2012

georg16nik
03-22-2012, 11:07 AM
+1

I'd love to see Kodak stick around. However two posts in this thread really crushed whatever enthusiasm I might have had:

1) The notion that Kodak could do nice things if it freed itself from obligations to former employees

2) Someone made a comparison with "Adox".

I couldn't support Kodak products if they fkd employees over. As for Kodak learning anything from "Adox", I wouldn't go anywhere near Kodak products any longer if Kodak did anything at all the way those companies do. "Kodak" would end up being nothing more than a resurrected brand name pasted on junk in an effort to capitalize on the legacy of the brand.


nothing more than a resurrected brand name pasted on junk
Michael, please, explain what is junk?

So far, Kodak looks like a bunch of drunk, overdosed teenagers whose spent their dads money and are currently in the big screwup situation, their employees and customers are paying for all mistakes.

Michael R 1974
03-22-2012, 11:15 AM
They certainly did screw up the company, but the quality of the products and the technology in their films has always been top notch. I would not want to see that compromised in the context of a low volume niche company.

georg16nik
03-22-2012, 11:31 AM
They certainly did screw up the company, but the quality of the products and the technology in their films has always been top notch. I would not want to see that compromised in the context of a low volume niche company.
Michael, all photographic materials currently on the market are good enough.
If Your skills are top notch, it doesnt mater if its Kodak, Adox, Ilford, Shanghai, Lucky, Svema, Tasma, ORWO, Rollei, EFKE etc.

PKM-25
03-22-2012, 11:37 AM
Anyone noted the trajectory of demand for film? It doesn't appear to be up, does it?

Still waiting for the OP to post a reference for the speech/address that started all this hyperventilation.

Ah, cool, so you saw that cruise missile of 200 rolls of Acros 100 in 120 from Adorama at $2.69 a roll go flying by? The trajectory is my fridge sir, sorry I did not file a flight plan...

Yeah, I am as optimistic as anyone, but this hyperventilation party makes 4:20 at CU Boulder look like a blown out candle....I think some on here have spiked the bong water with vodka, lol!

Michael R 1974
03-22-2012, 11:44 AM
Michael, all photographic materials currently on the market are good enough.
If Your skills are top notch, it doesnt mater if its Kodak, Adox, Ilford, Shanghai, Lucky, Svema, Tasma, ORWO, Rollei, EFKE etc.

I strongly disagree with that. In my experience, there is Kodak, Ilford, and Fuji. And then there's everything else.

I'll leave it at that so as not to totally divert the thread.

batwister
03-22-2012, 12:02 PM
In other news, the Concorde is coming back. "Never mind the destination, look how gorgeous those seats are!"
Kodachrome, shmodachrome. Isn't it more important to keep what little we have left accessible and cheap(ish)? This is no time for nostalgia.

If 'on demand' is a possibility, what about custom made emulsions? That, I would be interested in.

jnanian
03-22-2012, 12:08 PM
i think it is very strange that it took them 8-10 years to figure out that with a declined customer and sales base
they need to reduce output ...
i wish them the best of luck in this new phase of their revival.

PKM-25
03-22-2012, 12:13 PM
I am cautiously optimistic...

railwayman3
03-22-2012, 12:14 PM
I strongly disagree with that. In my experience, there is Kodak, Ilford, and Fuji. And then there's everything else.

I'll leave it at that so as not to totally divert the thread.

I don't disagree that those three names represent reliability and quality at the present time. But let's not forget the work done by skilled amateurs and professionals over 150+ years with materials which, by present day standards, would be considered primitive and poor quality.

Any films and papers from the first half of the 20th Century would probably fall within your definition of "everything else", but I wish my own skills were good enough to match the old-time great photographers....even with my access to the finest modern materials. :)

Thomas Bertilsson
03-22-2012, 12:23 PM
Well, if there's any hint of reality in the statements made, I'd like to see two things discussed:
1. Cost. I don't know about the rest of you, but often times when products are in their curve of demise, producers will raise prices, because those who really want it badly enough will pay a very high premium anyway.
2. Supply integrity. I don't want Kodak films to be like some of the items Freestyle carry, where they all of a sudden run out of stock and can't get any more for a month or two. It has to be readily available.

I'm also cautiously optimistic. It's either this, or 'give up film' for Kodak. I would love to see Kodak Ektalure paper brought back, or how about Kodabromide? Yeah. We have enough films, but paper is what I'm really worried about.

jglass
03-22-2012, 12:28 PM
I LOVE optimism on this topic, even if cautious. I think maybe Kodak is like a lot of our economy: un-shackled from blind, greedy, stupid managers, good products may have a chance of improving out lives.

MDR
03-22-2012, 12:31 PM
Micheal don't discount Tasma film. They offer a range of Motion Picture B&W Films (Nk1, Nk2 and NK3) that are equal or better than Kodak's MP B&W stocks unfortunately their availability is a bit of problem. I agree with you that Kodak, Ilford and Fuji offer the best products for classic photographic use in terms of Q.C.

Dominik

Moopheus
03-22-2012, 12:56 PM
Well, if there's any hint of reality in the statements made, I'd like to see two things discussed:
1. Cost. I don't know about the rest of you, but often times when products are in their curve of demise, producers will raise prices, because those who really want it badly enough will pay a very high premium anyway.
2. Supply integrity. I don't want Kodak films to be like some of the items Freestyle carry, where they all of a sudden run out of stock and can't get any more for a month or two. It has to be readily available.


It's all a matter of demand, isn't it? If there's enough demand for a product (say Tri-X or Portra) to keep the lines running and distribution channels filled, that will happen. If it's more on-demand fulfillment, supply may be spotty. Prices likely higher per unit. Are they going to use projections and make, say, a six-month supply at one go? A year? That's basically what they were doing with Kodachrome. How much inventory do they want to hold? As little as possible, I'd guess.

One question that comes to mind: if Kodak can do it, can Fuji do it too? They aren't as bad off financially as Kodak, because they've managed better with the digital transition. But they are cutting products. I like Acros and would like to know they can keep making it.

CGW
03-22-2012, 01:04 PM
The meeting looks legit
http://www.smpte.org/sections/hollywood/events/hollywood-section-meeting-march-20-2012

Fine but I'd still really like to see a transcript of her talk and/or credible press coverage. Otherwise, all we know is that she spoke at SMPTE on 3/20. Frankly, if Kodak used this occasion to announce something wonderful, it's not shown up anywhere else aside from the OP's 2nd hand reference, right?

zsas
03-22-2012, 01:08 PM
Agree, wd be nice if they post a video of the meeting. Didnt some spokesperson accidently reveal a new cellphone model the other day in Japan recently, think the person uploaded a pic of this phone to Flikr accidently and let the cat out'a the bag....me hopes it was a slip at that meeting that might be true...

Thomas Bertilsson
03-22-2012, 01:08 PM
It's all a matter of demand, isn't it? If there's enough demand for a product (say Tri-X or Portra) to keep the lines running and distribution channels filled, that will happen. If it's more on-demand fulfillment, supply may be spotty. Prices likely higher per unit. Are they going to use projections and make, say, a six-month supply at one go? A year? That's basically what they were doing with Kodachrome. How much inventory do they want to hold? As little as possible, I'd guess.

One question that comes to mind: if Kodak can do it, can Fuji do it too? They aren't as bad off financially as Kodak, because they've managed better with the digital transition. But they are cutting products. I like Acros and would like to know they can keep making it.

Absolutely it's about demand, and you're right about inventory too - mismanaged inventory ties up cash like crazy and I imagine shorter runs 'on demand' is a way to alleviate the need for large inventory of raw material, in process, and finished goods.
I work in an environment where we're always hounded about forecasting properly, and keeping inventory levels down. It's tough for purchasing, marketing managers, and supply chain people to really gel and have as little as possible in inventory, while at the same time having excellent on-time delivery to customers.