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pbromaghin
08-24-2012, 12:14 PM
Fabrizio - the motion picture business is NOT part of the sale. And you have the description of the commercial film business correct - those are the heavy duty industrial type usages of film. There was some confusion elsewhere about what constituted "commercial film."

Ooooh. I've been wondering this the whole time reading this thread and the one over at RFF. How can this separation be done when both motion and still are created on the same machine? Who gets the machine, the buyer of still, or the keeper of motion? Based on relative volume, I think I know the answer, and it won't mean good things for the people in this forum. We have had it impressed on us by former Kodak employees, just how difficult it has been to replicate a film even at a different Kodak facility, not to mention by a different corporation that will be likely be building its own machines.

railwayman3
08-24-2012, 12:22 PM
I really just wonder why we are spending any more time with Kodak. We have two honest and communicative b&w manufacturers (Ilford and Adox) who appear to be sound businesses and committed to the future. Each offers a good range of products...yes, we'll miss out Tri-x and Plus-x, but surely now is the time to be getting used to the options and supporting these remaining few manufacturers.

(and nothing against Colleen, but she's just a PR person who admits she knows little of corporate policies, so anything she can say at this time is likely "too little, too late". :(

BrianShaw
08-24-2012, 12:26 PM
I really just wonder why we are spending any more time with Kodak.

perhaps because some people still shoot color.

NB23
08-24-2012, 12:26 PM
I switched to Ilford as well, and I DON'T share your opinion.

Ken

Well, let me serve you the smartass comment you served me, just a few moments ago: Knock it off. This isn't all about you.

slumry
08-24-2012, 12:28 PM
Must have Portra!

cdkrenzer
08-24-2012, 12:32 PM
I really just wonder why we are spending any more time with Kodak. We have two honest and communicative b&w manufacturers (Ilford and Adox) who appear to be sound businesses and committed to the future. Each offers a good range of products...yes, we'll miss out Tri-x and Plus-x, but surely now is the time to be getting used to the options and supporting these remaining few manufacturers.

(and nothing against Colleen, but she's just a PR person who admits she knows little of corporate policies, so anything she can say at this time is likely "too little, too late". :(

No offense taken - but let me clarify - I work with a specific product group, not with corporate. Therefore, I am not privy to discussions about how a sale would proceed. What I can tell you is that Kodak is continuing to manufacture the films and papers in its portfolio and will continue to do so. As part of the sale, the intention of the company is to find a buyer who will continue to make the same products and services currently produced. I say "intention" because its early in the process. But licensing the brand is one thing that the company will consider, and it would be a term subject to negotiation. If you look historically at the businesses Kodak has sold, those businesses have been successful.

But really - "Just a PR person?" Ouch :)

MattKing
08-24-2012, 12:34 PM
I really just wonder why we are spending any more time with Kodak. We have two honest and communicative b&w manufacturers (Ilford and Adox) who appear to be sound businesses and committed to the future. Each offers a good range of products...yes, we'll miss out Tri-x and Plus-x, but surely now is the time to be getting used to the options and supporting these remaining few manufacturers.

(and nothing against Colleen, but she's just a PR person who admits she knows little of corporate policies, so anything she can say at this time is likely "too little, too late". :(

Because if Kodak disappears, and no one takes over their business, then:

1) there will be no North American manufacturer of film;
2) there will be no European or North American manufacturer of colour paper;
3) there will be a huge decrease in the market for the ingredients and materials used in the manufacture of the materials we use; and
4) as a result, all the other manufacturers of analogue products will be at a greater disadvantage.

The people at Kodak that actually make the products we like, and the machinery and materials they use, are really important to the worldwide markets.

The management at Kodak are motivated by concerns (stock markets and now, the creditors in bankruptcy) that film and analogue materials can no longer satisfy, but that doesn't mean that Kodak is irrelevant to the smaller markets that are important to us here at APUG.

Ken Nadvornick
08-24-2012, 12:35 PM
perhaps because some people still shoot color.

Yes, exactly. Providing the quality was still there, I would come back to a post-Kodak film manufacturing company for color in a heartbeat.

Ken

JeanLouise
08-24-2012, 12:35 PM
I am new here, but my feeling is it could be a very, very good thing if someone else invests the $ into film business that Kodak has been unable / unwilling to do (to the extent it should). As long as the film formulas remain the same (I understand Kodak will still do the manufacturing as it does today), I am happy that quality remains. Let someone with some imagination and appreciation for the art of film open up some new possibilities for future.

BrianShaw
08-24-2012, 12:51 PM
But really - "Just a PR person?" Ouch :)

Think of it this way... at least nobody called you a spin-doctor! :laugh:

dr5chrome
08-24-2012, 12:58 PM
..so how 'bout it Ron? coming out of retirement ?






This is either terrible news, or great news.

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20120823006226/en/Kodak-Takes-Steps-Successful-Emergence

batwister
08-24-2012, 12:59 PM
I really just wonder why we are spending any more time with Kodak. We have two honest and communicative b&w manufacturers (Ilford and Adox) who appear to be sound businesses and committed to the future.

I think we're lucky to have Colleen at least offering to provide a little clarification here - even if it is a precaution against people bad mouthing Kodak. It's a corporate business, not a 'grass roots' specialist company like Ilford - with whom it's not too much to expect a little communication. People 'waste' their time with Kodak because the products are exceptional and I feel that needs to be emphasised. If you want better communication with the people connected to your media, probably best to take up painting and hang around at your local crafts store! Would you refuse to pay for your meal without first speaking to the chef?

BrianShaw
08-24-2012, 01:01 PM
Because if Kodak disappears, and no one takes over their business, then:


Technically speaking... all that is just as true if someone buys and moves it "offshore".

zsas
08-24-2012, 01:02 PM
..so how 'bout it Ron? coming out of retirement ?


I can read it now, my dream: Formulary and Freestyle form a consortium that buys the rights to Kodak still film, the consortium hires Ron has their head of Ops!

ME Super
08-24-2012, 01:02 PM
Glad to see Kodak finally has a rep. on here. A hearty midwest welcome to her!

Unfortunately, Kodak lost most of my business when they dropped E-6, as I am primarily a slide shooter. They do have some nice negative films. The colors for those are great for printing and scanning but all wrong for projection :D

I do shoot B&W now and then (but it's pretty infrequently) and for that Tri-X works pretty well so I hope that stays around. My daughter is getting into film shooting though so I'm gonna pick up some Kodak for her to use. Just gotta wait until payday...

railwayman3
08-24-2012, 01:13 PM
I think we're lucky to have Colleen at least offering to provide a little clarification here - even if it is a precaution against people bad mouthing Kodak. It's a corporate business, not a 'grass roots' specialist company like Ilford - with whom it's not too much to expect a little communication. People 'waste' their time with Kodak because the products are exceptional and I feel that needs to be emphasised. If you want better communication with the people connected to your media, probably best to take up painting and hang around at your local crafts store! Would you refuse to pay for your meal without first speaking to the chef?

Please re-read my post. I wasn't badmouthing Kodak.
(But not too sure why you believe Kodak should be excused from communicating with it's customers because it's a "corporate" business?)
And I wasn't saying that people were wasting time with Kodak
products...of course they're "exceptional", we don't need to be told that!! (I started with a Brownie Cresta, Verichrome Pan, and Velox paper!).
But maybe now is the time to start getting used to the exceptional products made by the other, last few. manufacturers...support them and maybe there will be a better chance of a few more years....

ChristopherCoy
08-24-2012, 01:23 PM
Maybe this is more appropriate now...

55901




Agreed...

lxdude
08-24-2012, 01:30 PM
Well, let me serve you the smartass comment you served me, just a few moments ago: Knock it off. This isn't all about you.

Please just stop.

batwister
08-24-2012, 01:35 PM
Please re-read my post. I wasn't badmouthing Kodak.
(But not too sure why you believe Kodak should be excused from communicating with it's customers because it's a "corporate" business?)
And I wasn't saying that people were wasting time with Kodak
products...of course they're "exceptional", we don't need to be told that!! (I started with a Brownie Cresta, Verichrome Pan, and Velox paper!).
But maybe now is the time to start getting used to the exceptional products made by the other, last few. manufacturers...support them and maybe there will be a better chance of a few more years....

Just that Kodak film is simply a mass produced product, not bespoke furniture. More Ikea than the town carpenter who we might bump into at the shop.

I agree that people should support Ilford, but not just because we can speak to someone who works there. This isn't a reason to stop shooting Kodak. If only I could stop smoking because Richmond don't talk to me! Now that someone from Kodak is here it just looks like children sulking and feet stomping in front of their parents. As adults maybe we should try to reason with Colleen and get some much needed information.

Sal Santamaura
08-24-2012, 01:36 PM
...digital dentistry...Digital dentistry seems to increase the quality...I'm really satisfied with the quality of care provided by my dentist of 33 years, who engages in digital dentistry. He's always used all his fingers when working on my teeth. :)