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eclarke
10-08-2012, 06:28 AM
I am addicted to the Aura 4x5. Will buy it in 4x5, 5x7, 8x10 and 11 x14.. I would also jump all over a traditional film with no anti halation layer.

PeterB
10-08-2012, 06:58 AM
Wow. The potential of a true IR film from Ilford in at least 120 format is getting me very excited !! I am a veteran HIE user and still have some rolls in the freezer (albeit in 35mm format). I know Stephen Frizza (http://www.apug.org/forums/members/stephen-frizza/) would be excited about this indeed, at one point he shared with me that was going to meet with PE and learn the black art of using this special IR sensitive dye (in HIE) which is apparently hard/impossible to buy anymore.

I would be happy to pay $20/roll for this. I would be even happier if it had no antihalation layer to further mimic the ethereal and dreamy characteristic of HIE.

So Simon, is it worth us trying to drum up some support for this from our fellow film enthusiasts ?

Stephen Frizza
10-08-2012, 10:02 AM
I never learned HIE type emulsions from P.E though ide have loved to. P.E has been instrumental with guidance and expertise to me on many other things. I am lucky enough to have hundreds upon hundreds of rolls of HIE and EIR in deep deep freeze. but in saying this, it was a film i loved and I supported it by buying large quantities. (its a shame others didnt do the same or it might still be with us) I also have a few hundred sheets of HIE in 4x5" so meh I don't care for the prospect of Ilford making a new true infra red film. I also get pleasure knowing if I use my reserve of this film in the future in contemporary ways I will be able to achieve imagery with looks others can not.

If I was Ilford I would be very very wary of venturing into true Infra Red. The cost of R&D and production of the film versus the profits from quantity sold would have to be taken into extreme consideration. I feel although loved, these types of films have been discontinued for good reason. When I ask the bulk of people who love these films how much they would be willing to spend to buy a roll and how many rolls they would realistically shoot per year I would advise Ilford to snuff out any talk of such films being resurrected. Sorry to throw the unexpected out there.

Stephen Frizza
10-08-2012, 10:06 AM
I would be happy to pay $20/roll for this. I would be even happier if it had no antihalation layer to further mimic the ethereal and dreamy characteristic of HIE.



$20.00 a roll? HIE cost more than that retail when it was discontinued. If such a film came back into production I would expect it to come back for far higher, twice perhaps three times the cost of the past. If photographers baulk at the price the question needs to be asked, how much are the images your producing with the medium worth? I know its not what people want to hear and sorry to be a Buzz Kill but I'm being as realistic as possible.

Roger Cole
10-08-2012, 11:07 AM
I'd shoot 5-10 rolls a year at $20 a roll, at a guess. Probably at least 50 sheets of 4x5 if it wasn't more than, say, $2 per sheet too.

I've no idea how many other folks would or how many Ilford would need. But I don't think this is exactly a black art. Simon said they could easily do it, if the demand is there. Maybe a once per year special run, or even two years - it seems to keep well enough for those periods if kept frozen.

I have 15 rolls of 120 IR820 in my freezer now - well, 14 rolls with one in a 645 Pro back - and 10 rolls of IR820Auro 35mm.

steven_e007
10-08-2012, 02:56 PM
OK, I'll chip in, too. I'd love to see a special run. I believe it is more a case of sensitising an existing emulsion, rather than the massive (and none viable) R & D investment required for a completely new film. Surely a good opportunity to suck it and see?

The film I miss most is actually Konicas IR film. This wasn't so much an extreme IR emulsion like HIE - but was very smooth and very fine grained. It did amazing things to skin tones and was a surreal portrait film.

Truth is, some digital cameras can do IR with the appropriate filter - the rest can do it with the IR coating srubbed off the sensor or the IR filter taken out. There is a lot of IR stuff from the digital guys on Flickr. I'd love to see something they can't do... like an ultra fine grain film in 4 X 5 and 120... say an IR sensitised Delta 100? No grain, silky smooth tones and IR sensitivity? Gorgeous!

But, if Ilford introduced anything at all that is new, in any format - I'd immediately buy a brick of the stuff as a show of solidarity.

bsdunek
10-08-2012, 04:21 PM
I to would buy an Ilford IR film. I have used a lot of EFKE, and am sad to see them ending production. Ilford, I love you to pick up IR production.

Scott Gibson
10-09-2012, 02:06 PM
$20.00 a roll? HIE cost more than that retail when it was discontinued. If such a film came back into production I would expect it to come back for far higher, twice perhaps three times the cost of the past. If photographers baulk at the price the question needs to be asked, how much are the images your producing with the medium worth? I know its not what people want to hear and sorry to be a Buzz Kill but I'm being as realistic as possible.

Wow, was HIE really $20 a roll? It was discontinued before I returned to shooting film so I don't know, but I was under the impression it was retailing for more like $14-15 US. Either way, I think we all are aware of the massive investment of money and R&D that would be needed to bring such a film to the market, and consequently, the unlikelihood of seeing a "true IR" film from Ilford. I'm just saying, it would be nice :)

I wonder what Ilford SFX would look like without an antihalation layer. Could be interesting, and possibly easier to produce than a true IR film? Just food for thought!

Roger Cole
10-09-2012, 02:31 PM
I keep hearing that but with no evidence. Would there need to be "massive R&D?" The IR sensitizing dyes are pretty well known, aren't they? I know there's always SOME R&D for a new film and testing to match it to the coating machinery and such, but Simon even said here on APUG that Ilford could "easily" make an IR film if the demand was there.

TheFlyingCamera
10-09-2012, 02:39 PM
If you want SFX without the antihalation layer, you can roll your own. Unload it from the cassette in complete darkness, wash it, dry it and re-load it in a bulk loader. Not saying this is EASY, but if you want it bad enough, voila.

steven_e007
10-14-2012, 08:51 AM
But wouldn't washing a film before exposing it also remove a lot of other good things, like the sensitization dyes and the substances that boost sensitivity?

cgross
10-14-2012, 10:18 AM
I'll add another vote for 4x5 and 120 formats!!!

polyglot
10-14-2012, 06:17 PM
But wouldn't washing a film before exposing it also remove a lot of other good things, like the sensitization dyes and the substances that boost sensitivity?

Sensitization dyes work during exposure not development. Washing them out is fine as long as you've already exposed the film.

Shmoo
10-31-2012, 05:10 PM
It looks like there's some Rollei IR film available at B&H.

L Gebhardt
10-31-2012, 07:00 PM
Sensitization dyes work during exposure not development. Washing them out is fine as long as you've already exposed the film.

But you want to remove the antihalation dyes before shooting too.

Stephanie Brim
10-31-2012, 07:17 PM
Not just 4x5. Get some 5x7, too. I'd shoot it. I couldn't buy up five million sheets, but I'd buy a pack and shoot it happily.

polyglot
10-31-2012, 07:43 PM
But you want to remove the antihalation dyes before shooting too.

Fair enough. Since I shoot moderately large (6x7, 4x5) films, the halation effects in Aura just look like softness rather than glow so I'd prefer to go without.