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Roger Cole
05-04-2013, 10:21 AM
I see nothing in that to contradict the film business being sold. It still looks like Kodak Rochester will continue making the film while marketing and distribution will be done by the UK owners, but Ron may have other inside information.

Photo Engineer
05-04-2013, 11:30 AM
As I said earlier, Kodak will continue to make emulsions and coat all current film products in B38 at Kodak Park. Nothing has changed in that regard, and it is stated as such by the EK rep above.

Color paper mfg. goes to the UK people.

PE

Truzi
05-04-2013, 11:57 AM
It always seemed clear to me that Kodak was not trying to sell the manufacturing. Press releases and news items I read back in September 2012 (when I started following it) made that point repeatedly - stating Kodak was going to sell the part that sells/markets the film (among other things), but keep the actual manufacture. The release linked to at the opening of this thread even states that, and says Kodak is trying to move towards a business-to-business model (B2B).

Aside from the comments on mismanagement, I also think Kodak has/had it's finger in too many pots and wasn't able to give any of them the attention they needed (I know, this is considered mismanagement as well, but not in the usual "bean-counting" sense). The divisions likely were not independent enough to adapt to the market quickly.

Hopefully this sale to a more-or-less dedicated group will give it the attention it needs.

lxdude
05-04-2013, 12:13 PM
So it's not good news after all, Perez will sill be milking the film division to pay his salary and bonuses.

Ian

It also means that Kodak retains all liabilities regarding the Kodak site and all outstanding obligations regarding Kodak film employees. I think removing that encumbrance from the retail film business helps it be viewed as viable.

Roger Cole
05-04-2013, 12:31 PM
As I said earlier, Kodak will continue to make emulsions and coat all current film products in B38 at Kodak Park. Nothing has changed in that regard, and it is stated as such by the EK rep above.

Color paper mfg. goes to the UK people.

PE

Manufacturing, yes, we know that. But will not sales and marketing of film move to the new UK owners? That alone could really help turn things around (or not).

Photo Engineer
05-04-2013, 12:48 PM
At present, the sales and distribution of the products is not clear. It has been sold, but what part goes to what organization is not clear except for the fact that the color paper distribution goes to the UK group.

PE

PKM-25
05-04-2013, 01:40 PM
How likely is it that Kodak C41 film is going to go away by the end of this year? I don't really care about B/W film from Kodak, because Ilford is committed to making B/W film and its future is secure for the time being.

I don't shoot much color anymore, shoot black and white at a ratio of 20/1 but I want Kodak color to stick around in order for those who really want to use it to be able to....see the pattern there? It's not really cool to say you don't care about a film that some of us depend on to earn a living, next time just leave that opinion out, ok?

Portra should be fine for several years as like other Kodak still films, it is riding on the coat tails of the making of motion picture stock which Kodak is under contract to produce through 2015. If that is not good enough for you, I suggest you be responsible to your needs and stock up like many of us do.

As for the new speculation on this thread, I bet it is time for Colleen to weigh in again as thoughts seem to have drifted instead of being patient to wait for the next *Official* statement from Kodak in regards to this latest development.

Pioneer
05-04-2013, 01:58 PM
I shoot black and white, but I still shoot a bunch of color, Kodak color. I sincerely hope it does not go away anytime soon.

MattKing
05-04-2013, 02:02 PM
I wonder what is going to happen with the products that they have already licensed - such as their photo chemicals.

Sal Santamaura
05-04-2013, 02:21 PM
At present, the sales and distribution of the products is not clear. It has been sold, but what part goes to what organization is not clear except for the fact that the color paper distribution goes to the UK group...Seems pretty clear to me.


All of our paper manufacturing capability, IP and team around the world will move to the new company. Our consumer and professional film will continue to be made in Kodak’s film factories via a long-term supply agreement.


To clarify, Kodak will MANUFACTURE both motion picture and still film in Rochester. The BUSINESS of still film is part of Personalized Imaging and is part of the spin-off and will be supplied to KPP as part of a long-term supply agreement.Still films will be made by Kodak, which will supply them to the new English KPP-owned sales/markeing entity (as yet not named), which in turn will distribute/market them. The only question not answered (which Colleen essentially indicated she knows but is unable to reveal) is for how long Kodak will supply those still films. Colleen has communicated that still film demand going forward will play a significant role in determining the supply duration.

The following is the only thing I've posted that isn't fact-based: Kodak's agreement with the KPP-owned marketing/distribution entity probably requires it to supply still films for a minimum number of years and, after that, includes a minimum annual volume for each product. If the new entity doesn't order at least the threshold quantity of a specific product after the calendar-based guarantee has expired, Kodak would be able to cease production of it. There may also be an aggregate minimum product quantity minimum after the guarantee date. This is the kind of arrangement one would expect both parties could live with.

Bob Carnie
05-04-2013, 02:37 PM
Ron
Do you envision that the plant would ever consider black and white paper in rolls.??


As I said earlier, Kodak will continue to make emulsions and coat all current film products in B38 at Kodak Park. Nothing has changed in that regard, and it is stated as such by the EK rep above.

Color paper mfg. goes to the UK people.

PE

Photo Engineer
05-04-2013, 02:59 PM
Bob;

B38 will never, AFAIK, make paper based products. The cleanup is very very expensive due to dust, which film coating does not produce. Nor do I envision the Harrow plant ever making film.

Sal;

The reason I said things are unclear... A few months back, Kodak Rochester announced a marketing agreement for film products. Due to the present announcement, it is currently unclear what kind of arrangement will be made regarding this previous agreement and the current one.

PE

shutterlight
05-04-2013, 03:42 PM
I don't shoot much color anymore, shoot black and white at a ratio of 20/1 but I want Kodak color to stick around in order for those who really want to use it to be able to....see the pattern there? It's not really cool to say you don't care about a film that some of us depend on to earn a living, next time just leave that opinion out, ok?

Portra should be fine for several years as like other Kodak still films, it is riding on the coat tails of the making of motion picture stock which Kodak is under contract to produce through 2015. If that is not good enough for you, I suggest you be responsible to your needs and stock up like many of us do.

As for the new speculation on this thread, I bet it is time for Colleen to weigh in again as thoughts seem to have drifted instead of being patient to wait for the next *Official* statement from Kodak in regards to this latest development.

If Kodak stops making B/W film, you can switch to Ilford film. If Kodak stops making color film, that's the end of the road. There's nowhere else to go. Obviously I care about Kodak's film production, no matter what the film in question is, but I'm not particularly concerned about what they do with B/W film. Ilford is committed to making their film and is in sound financial condition. As no one else makes C41 film right now, Kodak's color film production is of far greater concern to me. If Fujifilm was still making their 400h film and was committed to it, I wouldn't be as concerned as I am. I'm not really into the particulars of a given film, since they're all great. It's just a matter of having one to use.

I can't really afford to stock up, and certainly not with much at a time. I'm a student, not someone with a lot of money to invest in film. Even if I could stock up, it would be good enough for perhaps one body of work and that's all.

AgX
05-04-2013, 03:48 PM
If Kodak stops making color film, that's the end of the road. There's nowhere else to go. ... As no one else makes C41 film right now, Kodak's color film production is of far greater concern to me...

What do you mean by that?

Sal Santamaura
05-04-2013, 04:15 PM
...A few months back, Kodak Rochester announced a marketing agreement for film products. Due to the present announcement, it is currently unclear what kind of arrangement will be made regarding this previous agreement and the current one...Are there any links that describe the earlier announcement? Whatever it said might be just as much history as the previously announced sale to Brother is. :D

Update: Might you be referring to this post by Fred?


http://www.apug.org/forums/viewpost.php?p=1390796

If so, it sounds like the same arrangement.

perkeleellinen
05-04-2013, 05:08 PM
As no one else makes C41 film right now [...] If Fujifilm was still making their 400h film

Have I missed a major announcement?

Roger Cole
05-04-2013, 05:31 PM
Fuji is still making C41, or at least they are still selling it. The one kind of film I CAN buy easily in local stores, even Wal Mart, is Fuji consumer 35mm C41. It's not what many of us want, but it IS C41. If they can make it in 35mm then it's easy enough to make it in other sizes, at least for Fuji. Now whether they would or are, those are other questions.

shutterlight
05-04-2013, 05:57 PM
Reala is listed as discontinued by B&H. It stopped being made in 35mm some time ago, and only 120 was left.

I'm not sure what I was thinking about 400h, though. B&H is still selling it, and hopefully Fujifilm is still making it, and will continue to make it. Apologies for the mistaken post a bit earlier.

Paul Goutiere
05-04-2013, 06:07 PM
Apologies for the mistaken post a bit earlier.

Jeez! I damned near had a stroke!

pentaxuser
05-04-2013, 07:34 PM
Under a less serious illusion General Jack D Ripper sent Slim Pickens over the North Pole to bomb the Soviet Union...cue Vera Lynn against a backdrop of mushroom clouds created by the Soviet Doomsday Machine, singing "We'll meet again, don't know where, don't know when....

pentaxuser