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jimgalli
03-18-2006, 03:16 PM
You knew this was coming didn't you. I know this has been done in the past...but...I think with the analog nature of the Cirkut Camera, APUG may prove to be an enduring place for an updated list of Cirkut owners and their specialties.

I don't have any HTML skills so this will be very simple.

It would be great to follow a format loosely following the questions below:

1.) How many and what size Cirkut's do you own?

2.) Do you offer any special services to the Cirkut community? Like gears, or parts or restorative / repair services?

3.) How many years involved with this type pano cameras? Are you a collector or a user? Or both?

4.) Website? Pix on line?

5.) Whatever it is that I forgot that someone will remind me of later??

Finally, I know there are a LOT of Cirkut owners that haven't yet made their first Picture. Join the list anyway! Don't be intimidated regardless of your level of involvement.


OK, I'll start us out and that should be enough to qualm anyone elses reservations because of in-experience.

I own 2 1/2 cameras, the 1/2 being for sale here on APUG. I own a #10 that hasn't even arrived yet, and a #6. I just sold the #8 that was the topic of this discussion. (http://www.apug.org/forums/showthread.php?t=25366)

I don't offer any service or specialty other than being an enthusiastic newbie. I'd be happy to teach you all I know but we'd be done in 5 minutes.

I've been involved about 3 years although it's only a few weeks since I finally got to the point of actually using a camera and exposing film. I was busy building a new darkroom big enough to handle what these beasts can do. I consider myself a 'user'! I'm not a collector. I'm not a collector. I'm not a collector. (sorry, I have to keep reminding myself)

My website such as it is: http://tonopahpictures.0catch.com
The only scan I have online is here at APUG in the discussion mentioned.


So jump onboard. Maybe someone with HTML skills can do a decent job of organizing the list as it grows. If you have pix of your cameras.....post 'em.
Maybe Len and C. D. Ewen and others can re-direct some of the oldtimers here if they haven't discovered APUG yet.

Lachlan Young
03-18-2006, 04:02 PM
Has anyone ever been hit unexpectedly by a Cirkut camera during its rotation? If so, did it hurt? :D :D

Watch out, cameras have a propensity to breed in dark corners - just make sure there aren't any Aero Ektars nearby as freaky mutations might occur...

Lachlan

c.d.ewen
03-19-2006, 02:15 AM
I'll bite, Jim, and keep the forum activity level high.

I own only one working Cirkut - a Folmer & Schwing No 10. I had a very early Century No 10, but sold it to someone who would be far more likely to have the time to restore it than I. The Century Cirkuts are really pretty, with red bellows and wooden front standard; the F&S/Kodak versions are a bit more 'industrial' looking. I also have a non-functional No 8.

After watching for Cirluts on eBay for some time, I jumped on this No 10, and am very glad I did. A professional photographer from WVA (Harlan - his last name eludes me right now) was selling his backup camera. The machine worked well, straight out of the box. If any Cirkut wannabe can find the same situation, I'd highly recommend taking advantage of it.

I'd be curious as to how others came to be interested in Cirkuts. I've had a fascination for panoramic photography for years, but didn't indulge in any until digital cameras were available. After several years of 'doing digital' and experimenting with scans from Brooks Veriwide, Noblex and Horizon, I realized that analog was the most pleasing to me. I still do a 'quickie' digital every now and again, but the grand results that come out of a Cirkut are the most pleasing.

I don't have a website, and have to confess that I've never shown anyone a single Cirkut photo I've ever taken. For the most part, they've been experiments, e.g., matching gears and lenses, trying different developers, testing speeds and perspectives.

I will leave you with a link to a famous pano of mine, however, in the hopes that you'll find it amusing. It's a 360 degree Infra-red pano I took 5-6 years ago with an early digital camera, using early stitching software. Look all the way to the right, and you'll see my wife sitting on some stairs. This is the one and only time she ever feigned interest and accompanied me on a photo shoot. The reason it's famous is because it was the occasion on which she uttered her most memorable quote: "Why can't you take ordinary pictures, like everyone else?"

Here's the link. (http://auctionpix.co.uk/members/fyi968178.jpg)

jimgalli
03-19-2006, 02:25 AM
"Why can't you take ordinary pictures, like everyone else?"


Been there, heard that. Shortly followed by "I wish you'd take some pretty color pictures like you used to."

claytume
03-19-2006, 03:59 AM
I'd be curious as to how others came to be interested in Cirkuts.

I saw a Cirkut print on a wall...........that led me on a long path researching the prints, then cameras, the photographers and then finding someone to give me hands on training in the process. That was the key to getting a system up and running fairly quickly.

My motivation was to earn a living shooting them, I discovered early on that Cirkut photographers the world over had been extremely successful making a living shooting these beasts. They were also successful in keeping competition down by not training anyone. For a long long time if you asked a Cirkut shooter for training, even if you were staff they usually refused. Afterall you could set up in the same town and do the same job, right? I've heard that same story over and over again. Now they're all gone and the knowledge is thinly spread across a few individuals. I'd guess at less than 20 worldwide who are proficient at the whole process. Ten years ago that number would've been more than double but I know of a few top shooters that have since passed on.

For the record I only have one working camera, a #8..........yes I did bid on the #16 hoping to steal it. I don't have a #10 like the other guys because I like the wide angle performance of the #8 and I also prefer slightly smaller prints.

I'd be happy with a #5.....great little compact camera and light on film too.


Clayton

MattCarey
03-19-2006, 09:35 AM
These sound extremely cool...had my interest in photography been this high when I was first employed and had more time and money, I'd probably make a stab at it. As it is...well, hopefully I can see Jim's someday.

Here's a question--can you guys convince Sean to open a panoramic gallery where bigger files could be uploaded? My guess would be no (slippery slope and all--panoramic today, ULF tomorrow...)

Matt

claytume
03-19-2006, 04:43 PM
Here's a question--can you guys convince Sean to open a panoramic gallery where bigger files could be uploaded? My guess would be no (slippery slope and all--panoramic today, ULF tomorrow...)

Matt

Would be a good idea Matt, at least full screen width would be good. The reduced height means the files aren't going to be any bigger than what's allowed now.

Showing panoramics has always been a problem in any media. I've seen slide projections where they use 3 projectors side by side and a section of film in each. The film isn't simply cut up and projected butted up, apparently it doesn't work. Each section has a small overlap so there has to be a density change for those bits and the projectors have to be perfectly aligned.

The idea is to use the full height of a projector screen so a few of them are used. High aspect ratio panoramas need 5+ projectors and screens.

Clayton

jamie young
03-19-2006, 05:22 PM
I really like shooting with cirkuts as well
I have eight of them. One of each size and two#6 and #8 outfits. I've shot with every size but the #6 cirkut (not the oufit) Maybe this year for that.
I've been doing mostly alt printing with them lately. There are some photos of my printing stuff on my site, which needs updating and redesign.
http://www.jamieyoungphoto.com/Fineart1.html
I haven't done a lot in the last year for various reasons, but hope to this spring and summer.
I've started a small cirkut tech section at
http://www.jamieyoungphoto.com/jamie%20young%20%20cikt2.html
Thanks for starting this forum. Great idea
Jamie Young in Madison, WI

wfwhitaker
03-19-2006, 05:29 PM
Wow! Now I'm really impressed! Nice stuff, Jamie.

jamie young
03-19-2006, 06:09 PM
First, Thanks Will!.

I didn't answer all the questions so:
I guess I'm a user first and collector next. I have a bunch of al vistas as well.
I've been shooting with cirkuts for about eight years, and can operate them pretty well, at least some times. I've learned a lot of the various things that can cause trouble.If I can help at all with advice, I would be happy to.
Best, Jamie Young

claytume
03-19-2006, 07:27 PM
Jamie

great to see you here!

Looks like this forum might just drag in the members from the original panoramic list and get discussion going again. I think too there is a lot of interest from non panoramic shooters.

Clayton

rbarker
03-19-2006, 10:05 PM
Jamie - excellent work. Love the shots of the old tractors, and I'm confident those folks were happy to put their prides and joys on display.

Len Robertson
03-20-2006, 01:46 PM
Wow, after years of dreaming of a Cirkut/pan forum, suddenly it is here. Thanks to CD, Jim, and Sean for getting it going.

I was hesitant to confess I have five Cirkuts, but since Jamie admits to eight, I feel much better. I have a #6 Outfit, a #8 Outfit, a #6 Camera, and a #10 Camera; all F&S internal governor. Plus a Century Camera Company fan governed #10. At the moment, only the #8 Outfit is usable. All the rest need a certain amount of work. Three of these I've cobbled together from parts, so in addition to the cameras, I now have three interesting stories, and extra grey hair. I'm quite proud I resisted Jim's #6 fan Cirkut on eBay yesterday, although it was a struggle.

Jamie - I love your site, especially the tech section and the Rumley Oil Pull tractors picture. The Rumley must be the tractor equivalent to the Cirkut - big, slow, majestic. I would love to hear details on your #16. How you put it together, and what it has been like using it.

jimgalli
03-20-2006, 03:23 PM
Jamie, Your stuff rocks. Great website! I'm inspired. And I have a new deadline. The "great race" of 2006 with all the antique cars will finish a leg in Tonopah NV. on July 5. I'm hoping I can get them to put the cars up in the historic mining district for a Cirkut picture. Hmmm. Lets see, I could do color in the 10 and BW in the 6 :D:D

claytume
03-20-2006, 03:46 PM
Jamie, Your stuff rocks. Great website! I'm inspired. And I have a new deadline. The "great race" of 2006 with all the antique cars will finish a leg in Tonopah NV. on July 5. I'm hoping I can get them to put the cars up in the historic mining district for a Cirkut picture. Hmmm. Lets see, I could do color in the 10 and BW in the 6 :D:D

Jim

these sort of events are fun and a great way to get motivated. Planning is the key if you want success, I usually pre shoot a test and iron out all the bugs so that on the day everything runs sweet.

Get another film back for both cameras then you can run colour and B&W in both. My preference though would be B&W for this type of shot.


Clayton

jamie young
03-20-2006, 04:29 PM
I 'm just doing B&W with my cirkuts. I have a roundshot 65 70/220 that I use for color. I scan the 70 mm negs on a cheap epson and join in the middle when required. I tend torward a Hudson river scholl painting color palette anyway, so digital works well for my color work.Most all of my cirkuts are semi operational. The #16 needs some more tuning, and my #10 fan does too. Both my 16 and 10 are the same vintage. Ron Klein has recommended a modified fan, which I want to try. The 16 has so much width that it tends to band, and everyone has said it's very hard not to get at least some banding with the #16 cameras. My 16 came without a gearhead, lense, fan's, gears, etc. I got it on ebay for $1400
I had the 600 tooth gearhead made in Milwaukee for $600, plus $300 for the base, got a lense for $500,and am also using a 24" artar that I had. Another couple hundred buck for the other stuff, $600 for 400 feet of film and I was ready to go. After developing film from it, everything else seems small.

Jim- Looking forward to seeing the Great race shots this summer. Shoot a bunch before hand and get used to the camera. That helps a lot.
Ron Klein is on this list, and aside from having a great eye, is absolutely the best cirkut operator and camera repair person there is.His help has been tremendous for me. Looking forward to seeing more of Tonopah

I've been working on getting some al vista cameras working. Anyone shoot with them? I just developed my first neg from a 7-F and it actually worked!
Jamie Young

jimgalli
03-20-2006, 04:33 PM
Jamie, I've got a 5" Al-Vista but I've been so busy I haven't even played with it yet. It's a nice complete one but needs some restoration. jg

Terence
03-21-2006, 08:47 AM
I have no involvement with these folks other than that one of their Cirkut photos of the WTC is hanging in our office. It is specifically labelled "Cirkut Photo" and measures about 10". It could be a digitial print, but looks sharp enough (to me) to be a contact print. :

http://www.lapayne.com/about.htm

harleyman7
03-22-2006, 02:44 PM
Someone might have already posted the Library of Congress site which has a lot of cirkut pictures but also has video of a cirkut shot including the runaround of a person on the end, plus video of film development and contact printing of a negative. I always wanted a smaller cirkut (#6 or 8), but
they all seem to be incomplete or to high priced. I do have a 4x10 and an enlarger to make 8x20 prints. I also have an Al-Vista which is complete with all the fans. My first post by the way. The website for the videos:
http://rs6.loc.gov/ammem/collections/panoramic_photo/pnshoot.html

Len Robertson
03-24-2006, 07:20 PM
Harleyman - I finally had time to look at the Library of Congress video clips. Quite interesting! I'd seen the Shooting clip before, but it is worth seeing again. I hadn't seen the Developing or Printing clips. The developing method is one I hadn't heard of. The narration seems to oversimplify what is actually happening, but overall the clips are very good. It is nice someone went to the trouble of producing these. At least on my computer, the MPEG format clips give much better quality than the Quicktime. It is worth the long download time.