PDA

View Full Version : Print Exchange Deadbeats



Pages : [1] 2 3

gr82bart
03-31-2006, 03:50 PM
So after some PMs with the other Print Exchange Organizers Jeremy Moore, Carl Radford and PhotoPete, we have 14 deadbeats (2 repeat offenders) who owe 29 people prints.

So far there has been a deadbeat in every round of every print exchange, except Round 6 Group Print Exchange (since no one has PMed Jeremy yet).

You know who you are, so get printing and honour your committments!

Regards, Art.

ann
03-31-2006, 03:56 PM
how sad.

And then some wonder why more people don't get involved!

donbga
03-31-2006, 05:09 PM
So after some PMs with the other Print Exchange Organizers Jeremy Moore, Carl Radford and PhotoPete, we have 14 deadbeats (2 repeat offenders) who owe 29 people prints.

So far there has been a deadbeat in every round of every print exchange, except Round 6 Group Print Exchange (since no one has PMed Jeremy yet).

You know who you are, so get printing and honour your committments!

Regards, Art.
I think you should out the individuals publically if they are repeat offenders!

ras351
03-31-2006, 05:40 PM
What about a private blacklist maintained by the print exchange coordinators? You could ask for a reason from the non-contributing participant which is then put to a poll for the people who were participating in the exchange. If a certain percentage decide that the reason is not acceptable the non-contributing participant could be added to the blacklist and excluded for a certain number of months/years from taking part in print exchanges. I know I would be disappointed if I put the effort into making a print for an exchange and didn't receive one in return however there will be cases where the reason is legitimate (eg cyclones are wreaking havoc here at the moment).

Just a thought,
Roger.

John Bartley
03-31-2006, 05:52 PM
Art,

I'm on your list of "deadbeats". I owe a print. I have communicated with my creditor and we have an arrangement.

You seem to have a fixation on this "deadbeat" thing, so why don't you quit beating around the bush, print the list, get it out of your system and move on? Otherwise, drop it.

cheers

John_Brewer
03-31-2006, 05:57 PM
While I agree there maybe legitimate problems for some people, I think repeat offenders should at least be known to the exchange coordinators.

david b
03-31-2006, 06:01 PM
Albuquerque NM has just passed legislation that will post DWI offenders in the Sunday paper.

gr82bart
03-31-2006, 06:27 PM
What about a private blacklist maintained by the print exchange coordinators?That's what we have.

You could ask for a reason from the non-contributing participant which is then put to a poll for the people who were participating in the exchange.It's up to the individual organizers how they want to handle daedbeats. If I get a PM, I'll send a PM to the person concerned. Most say they will send their print and do, but a small few eventually don't respond.

Remember these PMs are sent long after the due date and only after PMs have been sent by the recipients or organizers. Many are active posters though - one even asked for donations of darkroom equipment and materials.

A few have left APUG permanently. One in the Blind Exchange, where I felt bad for the jilted recipient, whom I recruited to participate, I sent him a print personally.

I'm not into more work for the organizers with the poll thing. We're volunteers as it is and people should honour their committments like adults or PM the organizer if they can't. If the person asked gives a reason, fine, but when they don't respond, that's another matter.


I know I would be disappointed if I put the effort into making a print for an exchange and didn't receive one in return however there will be cases where the reason is legitimate.There are maybe two people that I would put into the category of 'deadbeat waiver', the rest should just stop procrastinating, get printing and send their print(s).

People on the deadbeat list will not be allowed to particpate in any print exchange, by agreement of all the print exchange organizers.

We may want to extend that to any member organized function?

Regards, Art.

gr82bart
03-31-2006, 06:32 PM
I think repeat offenders should at least be known to the exchange coordinators.They are.

This private blacklist only names those that we are told of. If we aren't told of anyone, they are not on our list.

Regards, Art.

gr82bart
03-31-2006, 06:40 PM
Make that 15 deadbeats now, owing 32 prints. I just got another PM.

Regards, Art.

ras351
03-31-2006, 06:54 PM
Art,

If you have a process in place to deal with non-contributing participants which you are happy with then fine. If you're unhappy yet not willing to change anything then I'm puzzled as to the purpose of your initial post. Telling people to expedite their printing in a public forum without naming them would appear to serve little purpose - a PM or email would work just as well.

Roger.

gr82bart
03-31-2006, 07:03 PM
If you have a process in place to deal with non-contributing participants which you are happy with then fine. If you're unhappy yet not willing to change anything then I'm puzzled as to the purpose of your initial post. Telling people to expedite their printing in a public forum without naming them would appear to serve little purpose - a PM or email would work just as well.So let's be clear. I'm one of the organizers. Yes I am jilted recipient too, but believe it or not, I don't personally care. I care about the particpants in my exchange who do not get a print and who because of their poor experience don't particpate and probably tell others not to as well. That's what I care about. It is the NUMBER 1 reason more people do not particpate in the print exchanges. (Number 2 has to do with the 'quality' of the prints they recieve, but that's another contraversy!)

So what's with all the secrecy?

Well, A while ago I asked the question what to do with all the deadbeats via a poll. It was clear that no one wanted anyone on the list to be named publically. I think I was called a Nazi in one PM or post for even asking the question. Two people dropped out of the exchanges because I had the gall to care about other particpants not getting their prints.

So I personally have been sending PMs. Many, many PMs. Lots of promises sent back and then for some, nothing, no response, nothing, no prints, but theye are active APUGers still.

This is what I have to deal with. Now if no one cares, but me, then fine, I will leave this all well alone and if you participate and don't get a print, too bad. Deal with it.

I'm just trying get ADULTS to honour their committment. If that makes me bad. So be it for now, but I'm willing to let the deadbeats off too, if that's what everyone wants.

Regards, Art.

komet
03-31-2006, 07:16 PM
Is the Postcard Exchange not covered by this deadbeat list?

anthony

ras351
03-31-2006, 07:26 PM
So let's be clear. I'm one of the organizers. Yes I am jilted recipient too, but believe it or not, I don't personally care. I care about the particpants in my exchange who do not get a print and who because of their poor experience don't particpate and probably tell others not to as well. That's what I care about.


Art,

I was not judging you - I was trying to determine the reasoning behind this thread. It sounds like you are not happy with the process currently in place in which case you, and the other print exchange coordinators, should consider changing it. The reason I suggested the poll is because it removes the coordinator from the line of fire and allows the people who are directly effected to decide the outcome. Place a reasonable deadline for this poll and any person who fails to provide prints after this time goes on 'trial'. Detailing the commitment up front would perhaps make people use more careful consideration before they put down their name yet still give them an out under exceptional circumstances. Having an expiry date on the blacklist allows for reform. As mentioned they are just some thoughts which may be helpful for future exchanges. Yes, it will be more work but it may also be fairer. For those curious I'm not on the deadbeat list. :)

Regards,
Roger.

donbga
03-31-2006, 07:55 PM
That's what we have.

one even asked for donations of darkroom equipment and materials.



Now we know the id of one of the deadbeats. :)

I'm being sort of tongue and check here but I do think there should be a policy in place and I think excluding the blacklistees from exchanges should be enough of a rebuke.

blaze-on
03-31-2006, 08:26 PM
Publicly referencing these individuals as deadbeats, named or not named, is uncool.

Until you kow all the facts, I would refrain from future posts like this.

I'm not one of them BTW...but I'd be pissed if I was.

Move on...

Bruce Osgood
03-31-2006, 09:02 PM
I've not been in any print exchange so I'm not one of the "deadbeats" (But you have forced me into defending myself before I've voiced an opinion (Not Cool).

The entire issue of who's a deadbeat and who's not has absolutely no relevance to the group (except in a voyeuristic way). This is only important to the moderator(s) who should be doing the best they can to keep the Exchange going, or find someone who will. I don't appreciate your airing dirty laundry in a public forum for whatever personal purpose you have.

And don't give that B.S. your doing your job, you're not when you can't handle the messy parts.

donbga
03-31-2006, 09:13 PM
Publicly referencing these individuals as deadbeats, named or not named, is uncool.

Until you kow all the facts, I would refrain from future posts like this.

I'm not one of them BTW...but I'd be pissed if I was.

Move on...

FWIW, I've been doing print exchanges here and other palces on the net for years. I've never been stiffed so to speak so I really don't have any hard feelings to vent about, but I think public candor about this topic is okay and should be openly discuseed.

The fact is, as I understand it, is they didn't fulfill their commitment and didn't respond to PMs. I think it is fair to discuss this idea in public because it does affect those of us who do participate and fulfill their commitments.

David A. Goldfarb
03-31-2006, 09:46 PM
I don't know if I've been "stiffed." I don't keep track of who "owes" me a print, but I do keep a list of who I owe a print to. Sometimes it takes a while for me to get prints out, but they do get out eventually.

I did back out of an exchange once on another forum, because I just didn't have time to make the deadline, but by the same token, I didn't receive any of the other prints in the exchange, since the organizer collected all the prints into portfolios and then redistributed them to those who had sent a print.

I suppose if we wanted to make sure the exchange was always equal, we could send all the prints to the organizer, and when they were all in place, the organizer would send them all out in this way. Maybe those who are really worried about this aspect of the print exchanges should establish an exchange in this form and call it the "Guaranteed Exchange" or some such, where no one will receive any prints unless they send one in. It would be a lot less unpleasant than acting like a collection agency.

jeffneedham
03-31-2006, 10:16 PM
all of the hostility around here really surprises me. these exchanges are a great idea. i just joined in one, and have already fulfilled my "obligation". all this talk of being "owed" a print seems to be getting nasty.

if you're going to sign up, then you might as well participate. if i don't receive a print, i'll be upset. i put some time and effort into making the prints (i sent two to my recipient), not to mention the five bucks it cost to send the package from the states to the UK.

by signing up for an exchange, you are making a commitment. maybe there should be a clause posted - if you sign up, flake out and fail to send your buddy a print, we'll arrange for a jailhouse style tattoo that reads "I'm a slacker" to be placed on your forehead, backwards of course, so you can read it in the mirror.