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Ian Grant
01-09-2009, 09:15 AM
We need a propper data-base on APUG !!!
There is so much knowledge on this site !

Greetings,
Peter

If you post any info you have then we can begin something more meaningful.

Søren, it may well be that I have a roll film back & some holders that will fit your Voigtländer, let me know what size does fit.

Ian

Soeren
01-09-2009, 10:00 AM
If you post any info you have then we can begin something more meaningful.

Søren, it may well be that I have a roll film back & some holders that will fit your Voigtländer, let me know what size does fit.

Ian



My (Currently only) Voigtländer holder marked "Voigtländer" is 151mm long and 101mm wide. Some more holders arrived today but thanks to this thread I identified them as Linhof holders, 141X101mm. Hmm So it seems I have 1 working holder and 4 extra sheaths. Talk about making every shot count :)
Kind regards

Ian
151X101 it is :)
Kind regards

Ian Grant
01-09-2009, 10:09 AM
Ian
151X101 it is :)
Kind regards

With or without a lip ? I only have one long plate holder, I'll check it when I'm in the UK.

I am looking into having some meta inserts made as they are very simple to make.

Ian

Soeren
01-09-2009, 12:11 PM
With or without a lip ? I only have one long plate holder, I'll check it when I'm in the UK.

I am looking into having some meta inserts made as they are very simple to make.

Ian

With.
Kind regards

Michael W
01-10-2009, 01:45 AM
I have a 9x12 Bergheil that came with four plate holders. There are some slight cosmetic differences in the backs but they all fit. As already stated the basic dimensions are 100 x 150 with a 7mm locating lip. The locating lip measurements are indicated by the blue lines I added to the photos. One of the holders came with a reducing insert to hold 6.5x9cm plates. That will come in handy as I have plenty of plates in that size. I don't have any 9x12 film inserts however & I'd really like to get some as I have film that I can't shoot because of this. I've nothing to trade but I do have money.
I've also included a detail of the top corner of the camera back to show the cutaway that the locating lip has to fit with. Best advice I read when first researching plate cameras was to buy one that comes with holders that fit the camera. Unless you already have a good collection of holders it can be difficult to get the right ones. Thanks to Ole for that tip.

mferrarini
03-23-2009, 07:34 PM
Sorry i can't post any pictures but I don't have a digital camera yet. I have a Certotrop 9x12cm. The Certo holders are very similar in appearance to Ian's Orion/Rodenstock holders way back in the beginning of this discussion. The measurements are 100mm wide by 150mm long with a 5mm locating lip. I also have Kodak and Zeiss Ikon 665/7 holders that fit, each having the same dimensions as the Certo holders, although there is a slight variation on the way the long edges are formed. Instead of a plain flat edge, the Kodak and Zeiss holders have a groove running along each side up to 5mm or so from the top, where the locating lip would be on the Certo holders. Different appearance, same functionality.
My Patent Etui 9X12cm takes 100mm by 140mm holders with a tiny 1mm locating lip at the top. Although the overall width is the same as the Certo, Kodak, and Zeiss holders, the latter holders will not slide freely into the Patent Etui because the width of each tracking edge is fractionally larger. I am using 3 1/4 x 4 1/4 inch film sheaths because I cannot find 9x12cm sheaths here in the US. I also have been unable to find 9x12cm "IDEAL" holders for an ICA 225 and Zeiss Ikon Ideal that I also have. I keep checking the auction site and specialty dealers here but haven't had any luck. Does any one know of other sources in in this great big world that may be able to help?

Ian Grant
03-24-2009, 03:59 AM
All the 9x12 holder I have that will fit my Orion Werks & Rodenstock, (and scrap Ernemann) cameras will fit both my Patent Etui's.

In a couple of weeks when I'm back in the UK the idea has been to start a swap thread for 9x12 holders to pass on the spares we have that don't fit our own cameras and hopefully get ones that do in return. I'm fairly sure I have one for Søren :D

Also I'm looking at getting a few 9x12 film sheaths fabricated, they aren't difficult to make, there was some discussion in another thread. It's taken me three years of searching to find some sheaths, I only need 6 maybe a dozen more.

Ian

mferrarini
05-06-2009, 10:56 AM
Ian, if you do succeed in fabricating the 9X12 sheaths, what are the chances of making a few 10x15cm? I have six double sided plate holders for my Toska 550 but have only been able to find three film sheaths (courtesy of Ole) in three years of sporadic looking. Unfortunately I am not very handy at any kind of fabrication. In addition, I am now the proud owner of an Ica Ideal 525 (10x15cm) but do not have any holders for it. I wonder how many years it will take to find those.

Ian Grant
05-06-2009, 11:41 AM
You've just reminded me I left an adapter with a sheet metal compan 2 weeks ago, they felt they should be easy to make. I'll check it out tomorrow or Friday.

Ian

Ian Grant
05-26-2009, 09:01 AM
Ian, if you do succeed in fabricating the 9X12 sheaths, what are the chances of making a few 10x15cm?

The company I've used for sheet metal work for the past 20 or so years couldn't make the adapters because they just don't work with metal that thin. I had to go elsewhere hence the delays, plus in the UK there were many holidays for Easter, Mayday etc, and much of the time I was away from base.

You need 0.3/0.4mm sheet to fabricate adapters, and a former of hardened steel approx 0.25mm to simulate the film and bend the edges around. The problem I ran into was the fabricators didn't have the sheet in stock & so it wasn't economic as they had to buy a whole sheet and I needed less than 2% of a sheet to make quite a number of adapters. If I'd visited a few other fabricators I might have struck lucky unfortunately my time was limited. I did get some new blades made for a 20"x24" Beard Masking frame and that cost me £2 ($3.20) so it can be done.

My dalliance with 9x12 blows hot/cold because of weight restrictions when flying, I still need to bring a developing tank and plate holders etc, and my baggage is always over weight, but once they are here I can start using them in earnest.

Ian

Farside
06-13-2009, 03:28 PM
I've just acquired a Welta 9x12 and need to know what film holders would go with it. From what I can make out, it seems the narrow edged lip is the deciding factor and might be the one known as the "normalfalz", is this right?
I attach a couple of pics of the GGS holder and would like to draw attention to the step at the bottom of it - this step rides up onto a lip at the bottom of the camera back - does this make it an odd one out, or is this normal?
Many thanks for all pointers.


http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.4070bb4292.jpg (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?4070bb4292.jpg) http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.9607bfbbab.jpg (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?9607bfbbab.jpg) http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.34fdef73fc.jpg (http://www.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?34fdef73fc.jpg)

Farside
08-21-2009, 04:55 PM
I recently bought another Welta which came with two Rhaco holders that fit the first one, although there's a difference in length, they being a bit short for the first camera.
Dimensions are 100mm wide x 138mm long with a 1mm lip on the long edges. Thumbnails one and two are of a Rhaco short plate.

Thumbnails three, four and five are of an AP Paris film holder that fits the Welta long body, but a slightly tight fit that will probably get a bit better with use and some candle wax on the edges. They have the internal dimensions for a 9x12 plate and not, as I first suspected, an old Imperial size. Overall size is 100mm wide and 150mm long with an edge lip of 1mm.

I also have a Rada rollfilm back that fits the second (short) camera, but because the Rada's got a groove instead of a lip the matching groove on the long body Welta is slightly too thick to accept it. This is a bit of a pita, as the Rada back would centre properly on the long body, whereas it's always a bit too far up on the short one.

renes
09-10-2009, 10:21 AM
Hi,

I have 6 film holders 9x12 (Zeiss Ikon, Voigdlander) with sheaths and it seems they are all made by someone and they look grate. I have not yet use them with my new Voigdlander Bergheil but all exterior sheaths size are 89x120mm. So 1mm less than nominal 9x12 film size (interior about 1,5mm less).

Does it matter for keeping film flat or for film loading?
Does nominal film size are exactly 90x120mm?

Ian Grant
09-10-2009, 01:13 PM
You need the film sheaths because the glass plates were held differently, you can use card but it's awkward, So it matters for both reasons.

Nominal size is 9x12 actual size maybe slightly less, there will be an ISO standard, now.

Ian

mferrarini
01-07-2010, 03:15 PM
I acquired these 9x12cm plate holders in order to obtain the film sheaths that were inside them. Although not quite up to the standards of Zeiss or ICA, these double sided holders are nevertheless precision built and have similar design features. They won't fit into any of my cameras. The larger model measures 111 x 167 x 15mm. The smaller is 111 x 158 x 12mm. Both have a 2mm wide lip along each long side. Both have small notches in the valley between the sides, to receive a locking pin on the camera body. Each dark slide is locked in place by a spring type mechanism that is squeezed to release it. The dark slides on the smaller model have metal "tongues" that fit into notches in the holder body. On the larger model two screws with round heads protrude from the body. The holders have metal handles with rectangular cut outs that "catch" the screw heads. Squeezing the handle releases it. Can anyone help to identify these holders?

Perry Way
04-27-2010, 06:53 PM
Having just acquired a very good condition Voigtlander Avus in 9x12 configuration and seeing some very lovely photos taken with another Avus on the internet (while researching this camera), now I want some film holders. Since I don't do plates, it is important to me to get holders that have those special sheaths Ian talks about.

So, anyone know if the Leitz Wetzlar anlegefalz 9x12 holders will work for a Voigtlander Avus? I've gone through all the other listings for sale and ruled everything else out. If anyone knows the answer to this question... then maybe I can get my hands on ONE film holder. Here's a photo of the one in question (this came from the seller).

JPD
04-27-2010, 11:46 PM
So, anyone know if the Leitz Wetzlar anlegefalz 9x12 holders will work for a Voigtlander Avus?
It doesn't look so. I understand that you're eager to start using the camera, but relax and check eBay every day and you will soon find original Voigtländer plate holders. I bought around twenty 6,5x9 plate holders for my Voigtländer Bergheil within a few months after getting the camera, and nine 9x12 after I bought my 9x12 Avus (and later also bought another Avus plus a Bergheil 9x12).

They are fine cameras and fun to use. :)

Anton Lukoszevieze
05-28-2010, 06:27 PM
9x12 holders with film sheaths do come up, I was frustrated for a while, but then found 12 very good Kodak ones. I love my 9x12 camera, 4 different lenses + Rada roll film back
and masks for 6x4.5, 6x6 and 6x9, it's a really wonderful system. Sometimes I miss the squarer 4x5 format, but 9x12 is very elegant. I like the ground glass and find that I take more time
for fotos and am happier with the results.

Perry Way
05-28-2010, 08:48 PM
9x12 holders with film sheaths do come up, I was frustrated for a while, but then found 12 very good Kodak ones. I love my 9x12 camera, 4 different lenses + Rada roll film back
and masks for 6x4.5, 6x6 and 6x9, it's a really wonderful system. Sometimes I miss the squarer 4x5 format, but 9x12 is very elegant. I like the ground glass and find that I take more time
for fotos and am happier with the results.

I got three from one of those buy-it-now sellers on eBay for $20! Just shot them yesterday first time with some hand cut HP5. Developed last night, got a little light leak going on, but I gotta say those Kodak holders are pretty well engineered but cumbersome in the darkroom. I need to bend one of mine back to normal. Then I'm going to sand down the gritty roughness of the dark slides and clean out the rust on the springs and anywhere I can find it, and then I'm going to repaint the items that were painted black, and dry lube the channel the dark slide goes down so the dark slide will be super slippery once it is pulled past the end clasp.

Anton Lukoszevieze
05-29-2010, 02:41 AM
The Kodak holders I use have a frame that leans out to fit the film sheet under and then this pushes down to hold the film in place. You don't have to slide the sheet in
like European holders, it is a little tricky but with practice quite straight forward. I also like that the contact prints I make have a clean border, no film notch :) 9x12cm may seem small for contacts
but they are jewel-like in their intensity. Have fun with your camera.