Leica wannabe owner has a few questions...

[gamincurieux]

They are pretty easy to load once you get used to it. The only problem is finding a place for the bottom while it's off. Camera, bottom plate, old roll of film, new roll of film, and only two hands for all of that.

Put the bottom in your mouth while loading, easy, your hands are free then, and have the camera up-turned at the end of the strap & resting against your belly for loading..... no don't slobber all over it like a dog, just hold it in your lips. Loading is easy! Sorry if that's already been suggested, I've not read all the way through the thread ;)

[Terrence Brennan]

Gee, what a load of really good info, after less than 24 hours after I made my post!

My thanks to all who have posted AND who will post. I was originally going to PM the APUGgers who replied, but, time constraints being what they are, I will have to cop out and make this posting instead.

I should have mentioned that my Nikon Fs have the plain, non-metered prisms, and that I haven't owned a camera with a working TTL meter in 32 years. To tell the truth, I haven't felt the loss; I swapped my last camera with a TTL meter, a Nikomat-EL, for a Graphic View camera and accessories in 1978.

I use a Gossen Lunasix-3 meter, usually in incident mode, when I use a meter at all. I estimate the exposure, and, on rare occasions, have ACTUALLY produced properly exposed frames; I was printing one of them last night, as a matter of fact. I had to search in my lamp stash to find a 75-watt bulb for my D-6!

As I tell a painter and sculptor friend of mine, who is attempting to learn photography, when one wants to calculate proper exposure, one must FEEL the light!

[Tim Gray]

Put the bottom in your mouth while loading, easy, your hands are free then, and have the camera up-turned at the end of the strap & resting against your belly for loading..... no don't slobber all over it like a dog, just hold it in your lips. Loading is easy! Sorry if that's already been suggested, I've not read all the way through the thread ;)

Haha, yeah that's what I do most of the time.

To the original poster - sounds like you can skip the meter. Or just get an M6 and leave out the battery. :D

[jnanian]

John, funny thing is that I have a camera or two somewhere with those sprocket hole marks on the pressure plate. Forgot which one. Perhaps one of my F-1s.

...and no, you did not drop a name in a $hitty manner to try and make a point, which is what riled me.

sounds like you could sell off the sprocket hole'd pressure plated cameras
for a boatload on eBoink. " see, just like garry! " :p


- john

[Xmas]

Hi

It is decades since I used a F with a meterless prism, nostalgia, if you are happy with a separate meter Leitz made two clip on ones, selenium and CdS & nowdays CV make modern clip on one. Or you can stick with the Gossen, as I do.

The M2 and M3 are cheaper then the M5 or M6 classic cause they have no meters, but for touch and feel they are unsurpassed by the (new) MP. They will accept a wider range of lenses, than either of the above.

The M3 finder is close to 1:1 and for a sole 5cm shooter is unbelievably good.

The M2 finder is 0.7 but with practice you can still use both eyes if you range find with the right eye. If you are left eye dominant I'd still recommend using the right eye, however unnatural it may seem, this also allows you to hammer the lever for the next frame if you are in a hurry.

Otherwise you need the TomA, lever wind base which is a low volume product (for an M2 only) or a M4-2 instead af a M2, and which leaves you with more freedom of choice (Leica or TomA).

There are 6, CV lenses in 35mm, Canon LTM lenses (from 60s), Zeiss ZM, Konica, and oodles of Leica lenses, all are good enough for close in reportage - f/ numbers from 1.2 to 3.5, the 1.2 is big some of the others are diminutive, even the f/1.4s.

Noel

[rpsawin]

I use a Gossen Lunasix-3 meter, usually in incident mode, when I use a meter at all. I estimate the exposure, and, on rare occasions, have ACTUALLY produced properly exposed frames; I was printing one of them last night, as a matter of fact. I had to search in my lamp stash to find a 75-watt bulb for my D-6!

As I tell a painter and sculptor friend of mine, who is attempting to learn photography, when one wants to calculate proper exposure, one must FEEL the light!

All M's have their champions as well as their detractors. IMHO your best bet is to handle as many different bodies as you can and see which feels best. I have M2, M6 and an MP. Each has a different feel. I enjoy each and all of them. I find the M2 to be my favorite camera. It is a joy to use. Since you are using an external meter and already guess at exposure I think the simplicity of the M2 would be a great fit.

Best regards,

Bob

[gamincurieux]

By the way, does aNYONE KNOW IF YOU CAN GET A BRASS TOP PLATE FOR A REGULAR m6 ttl? iT'S NOT THE SAME TOP PLATE AS FOR AN m7, IS IT?

Sorry, caplock ;)

[Mustafa Umut Sarac]

I will use Screwmount Leicas at my all remaing life. I believe smaller the viewfinder pupil , better the composition. I never used a lightmeter , I decide with my eyes. I can really cry for a Leica. I lost my job and the Leicas and now I have only money for copies. It would be great to have a ww2 , submariner leica copy from ebay. I am an archaeologist and remember what Agatha Christie says for her archaeologist husband , she says , his interest equivalently increased to her while she is geting older !

Mustafa Umut Sarac
Istanbul

[filmguy]

I recently purchased a M6 and have been very pleased with it.

[John Koehrer]

So then, what are the significant operational and quality differences, in the current MP/M4P/M6/M7 cameras? How do they compare with the classic M3/M4 cameras? How about ease of loading? What about the availability of accessories such as winders/motor drives, et cetera?

Any comments or personal input and/or experiences would be welcome. I can run a Google search and read info from a video screen, but what I am after is input from shooters who use them regularly. All information will be gratefully received!

Operational differences, M7 has auto exposure, M6 and MP have ttl meters and there are some complaints(boo hoo) that the shutter speed dial rotates in the "wrong" direction. M6/MP are available with different magnification finders.

M4p has no self timer and framelines for 28/35/50/90/135mm lenses but does have a hot shoe. Does have the rapid loading system

M4 has a rapid loading feature that makes it quicker to load than M2/M3.
Has Self timer, framelines for 35/50/90/135mm .72 magnification & crank on the rewind. No meter.

M3 bottom loading, framelines for 50/90/135mm, pull up rewind knob. .91 finder magnification. Take up spool has to be removed to reset counter. No meter.

M2 bottom loading, framelines for 35/50/90mm pull up rewind knob & manual set film counter. .72 magnifier. No meter.

M2/M3 may or may not have self timer or frame preview lever depending on when it was made.

I currently have an M3 and wear glasses. The 50mm framelines are difficult to see without moving my head, but the higher magnification makes for more accurate focus. The M2 is better in being able to see the 50 lines, but not enough difference for me to change.

I use 21/28 & 50mm lenses with Aux finders for the 21&28.

I've heard of quality differences in Canadian & German cameras but wouldn't be swayed by that myself. Folks on another forum are constantly asking what's the best Leica 50 or 35mm lens or body for me.
People that say they can see the difference make my eye glaze over.

[illumiquest]

Everyone is going to have a slightly better version of what camera works for them. Make some Leica friends and borrow ;)

I use an M2 and probably wouldn't buy anything else. They're cheap and reliable and have the 35mm frame which is really all I use. I do think that a built in meter would be nice but not essential.

Good luck!

[lns]

Well I thought only M3, M2, M4, M5, early M4-2 and MP had the flare free rangefinder spots, late M7 as well?...

Yes, they put the MP's viewfinder in the later M7s. See the alliterative gem "focus patch flare finally fixed" on Andrew Nemeng's helpful site, about one third way down the page here: http://nemeng.com/leica/002bb.shtml

-Laura

[cbphoto]

I'm a budget-conscious Leica-shooter, and use both an M2 and M4-2. The M2 is the nicest camera I've ever used. Nothing wrong with the M4-2 at all, just doesn't have that feel. I don't like the M4-P, M6, or M7 due to their busy finders. As an eyeglass wearer myself, I also can't see using an M3 (I also like to use 35mm lenses).

I think the stories of M4-2 problems are greatly exaggerated. I've had two, and they were both fine (sold one to get the M2). My M2 has the rapid loading deal, which makes it easier to load than the M4-2, at least to me. The take-up spool feels more solid and definite than the tulip. The rangefinder patch in the M2 is contrastier to my eyes than anything that came after, including a new MP I looked at a while ago. I also prefer the knob wind of the M2, but that again is totally personal. The angled wind crank of later models is the weakest point of the camera in terms of durability.

[Xmas]

Yes, they put the MP's viewfinder in the later M7s. See the alliterative gem "focus patch flare finally fixed" on Andrew Nemeng's helpful site, about one third way down the page here: http://nemeng.com/leica/002bb.shtml

-Laura
Hi Laura

Thanks

So as I read this 'from serial # 2 885 000 onward' is coated and has a condenser lens like the M2 and later till M4-2 mid run.

And from part way through M4-2 till 'from serial # 2 885 000 onward' you send it to repair person, for retro fit.

Noel

[Xmas]

The angled wind crank of later models is the weakest point of the camera in terms of durability.

Well I think the M4 had a brass lever but some time later they went to aluminum. If you are ham fisted you can bend the aluminum, if you drop the camera, and it lands badly. you need a new assembly.

I'm a dinosaur as well the M2 and M3 are nicer.

Noel

[Eric Rose]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/richardlehun/sets/72157623601924003/

[sangetsu]

My favorite (and the one I always carry) is the M4. It has the old-school quality feel of the earlier Leicas, with the styling to match the newer ones. I can't even guess how many rolls of film have passed through my camera, but the chrome plating where my fingers rest has been somewhat rubbed away, showing the brass beneath. It's winding action is smooth as silk, and nearly as quick as lightning. To say that I love it is an understatement. I'm shopping for another M4 to use while I send my current camera in for a CLA. My favorite lens is the 35/2.8 Summaron, other faves are the DR Summicron and 21/3.4 Super Angulon. The Summaron is a wonderful compact lens which produces great pics in B&W or color.

I'm sure you would be happy with any of the M cameras, each is different in it's own way, but not one of them could ever be described as bad.