PDA

View Full Version : erythrosin & eosin



Pages : 1 [2]

Photo Engineer
02-02-2011, 03:25 PM
Geiss is also the word for coat. So, we have an ambiguity here that I have not figured out.

The Japanese word for their coating operation is "Lay" and I used that early on at Kodak after a tour of the Japanese plant. It got quite a laugh from my co-workers. Each "secret" manufacturing facility uses their own terminology. When I teach, I use Kodak terminology. For example, we do not "confection" at Kodak, we finish or package.

As an afterthought, Erythrosine is so hard to adsorb to an emulsion, it is often added before precipitation so I cannot see it being added as an overcoat. Other dyes can probably be added in an overcoat.

PE

Q.G.
02-02-2011, 03:31 PM
Geiss is also the word for coat. So, we have an ambiguity here that I have not figured out.

Nope. "Giessen" is nothing more than "to pour".
You can indeed coat something by pouring something over that something. But it's not included nor implied by the verb "Giessen" itself.
So there may be ambiguities, but that's not one of them.

Ray Rogers
02-02-2011, 03:42 PM
I think in this case it takes on its meaning from the context;
if you pour on a "coating" you can squeeze the noun so hard it will willingly give you the verb!

Ray Rogers
02-02-2011, 03:50 PM
neru?
I thought it was nuru?

Confection is British?

Sounds so sweet!

Photo Engineer
02-02-2011, 03:53 PM
Nope. "Giessen" is nothing more than "to pour".
You can indeed coat something by pouring something over that something. But it's not included nor implied by the verb "Giessen" itself.
So there may be ambiguities, but that's not one of them.

In German, Geissmachin is Coating Machine. I agree that geiss also means pour. This is part of the ambiguity. Usually, pour is translated as Kippen or tip or dump. Again it is confusing.

PE

Q.G.
02-02-2011, 04:06 PM
In German, Geissmachin is Coating Machine. I agree that geiss also means pour. This is part of the ambiguity. Usually, pour is translated as Kippen or tip or dump. Again it is confusing.

PE

No, no.

"Giessen" is nothing more than "to pour".
"Kippen" is "to tilt", or indeed "tip".

Different thingies. You may have to 'kipp' something to 'giess' its content over something. You can 'kipp' something without it resulting in 'giessen'.
As in: you may have to 'tip' a container to 'pour' its content over something. But when you tip your hat, it will only pour something when its pouring with rain.
;)

The German thing is a pouring-machine, i.e. named after the action. While the English counterpart is named after the result.

(A "Geiss", by the way, is a "goat". A bit archaic word, but that's what it means.
So you were only one letter away from being absolutely right when you wrote "Geiss is also the word for coat" ;))

Photo Engineer
02-02-2011, 04:34 PM
Geiss = Goat and Giess = Coat (pour). Just a spelling error.

Notwithstanding my spelling error, an Agfa coating machine was called Giessmachin or pouring machine. So we have a problem about whether the 6 (plus several left out of the list) ingredients given in published Brovira formulas were poured into the emulsion or coated with it or over it.

Lets just leave it ambiguous and say that many ingredients including some type of sensitizing dye were added to the Brovira and Portriga formulas. Included in this mix was an unknown dye and Erythrosine depending on product.

That might be a suitable summary.

PE

Q.G.
02-02-2011, 05:56 PM
You would need a description explicitely describing the sequence in which things were done to be sure, i guess.

JOSarff
03-01-2011, 06:15 PM
Ron:

How much erythrosin would you add to say 125ml of emulsion, and where in the make would you add it for a good green sensitivity?

Joe

Photo Engineer
03-01-2011, 06:21 PM
Joe;

I would not recommend spectral sensitization of the Azo emulsion. I merely mentioned it and demonstrated that it can be done. If you want to do it, it should be added just before you add the spreading agent and the hardener. You hold for 15" before adding the spreading agent and the hardener and coat immediately. Depending on conditions, this addition speeds hardening up of the gelatin and you can end up with a ball of red jelly.

Did you solve the other problem?

PE

JOSarff
03-01-2011, 07:41 PM
Yes, I believe the melt was too hot and the thymol/alcohol too cold and did not allow for re-melting.

Am I reading correctly, `15 seconds, and the spreading agent is also called a surfactant? The erythrosin is dry powder.

Joe

Photo Engineer
03-01-2011, 10:14 PM
That was a typo. It is 15 minutes. I have to control my little pinky and shift key! Sorry.

Make up the Erythrosine as specified in the instruction sheet, page 8 IIRC. I will send details later.

PE