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  1. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by firecracker View Post
    I was hoping that this would open up a big discussion, but it didn't, much like many other threads in general. In a sense this is potentially more serious as a topic than the ones concerning the problems of Xray scans at the airports.
    In terms of attacks on freedoms that we took for granted even a few years ago, you are quite right. The insidious and chilling aspect is that those who wish to remove our freedoms rely on the fact that we can be fooled into quickly forgetting how much things have changed and we even find oursleves providing a rationale as to why these changes are "justified". The analogy with surreptitiously boiling the frog sitting reasonably comfortably in the ever warmer water in the pan springs to mind. By the time he realises what is happening, it is too late.

    The rationale runs: The authorities/ government must have good reason for doing what they are doing, otherwise they wouldn't do it. So it is unreasonable to hold them to account and ask that they justify such actions fully, providing cause and effect evidence and proof that the response is proportionate to the real threat.

    I could go on but the whole spectrum of views has been aired before on this site and unfortunately caused more problems than it has solved. I suspect that is why it has generated less of a discussion that you had hoped for.

    pentaxuser

  2. #72

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    I would bet a public place would be city centres, public or prominent buldings/landmarks and just about anywhere in London you care to mention.......this is not a joke, police are already busy harassing photographers under the prevention of terrorism act 2000. I know, they harassed me because I was 'obviously' a photographer but ignored the literally hundreds of 'normal touristy' looking people. Terrorists generally try to make themselves look as prominent as possible as a double bluff. Zawahiri wrote the 'terorist photographers handbook' stating, "Thou shalt capture the images of the infidel structures using a tripod (the bigger the better), sheet film and acutance developers. Mujaheddin brothers must shun the evils of digital cameras and the likeness of tourists for the boosoms of 72 virgins await only the brazen and devout devotees of Berleback tripods, Ebony Cameras and the Pentax Spot meter". The Govt really are a bunch of ignorant pr*ts, the level of intiative demonstrated by many beet coppers being little better it would seem. The same idiocy denies many parents the chance to look back on videos of their children in the school play (because everyone knows children need protecting from vilanous paedaphiles getting off on children dressed up as 'Noah and the animals'. People get the politicians they deserve and so the solution lies in our hands.

    I recall a similar issue with the NY police not too long ago that claimed the NYC were in breach of the law.
    Last edited by Tom Stanworth; 02-22-2007 at 09:53 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  3. #73

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    I thought after the subway bombing that the authorities obtained much valuable evidence from all the cell phone and point-n-shoot cameras people had. This obviously is not enough to counteract the stupidity we see more and more in our two countries.

  4. #74

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    This has been a recurring theme in my AP column. Kast week's (issue of Feb 24) suggested the photographic equivalent of the 'Mass Trespass' movement by ramblers that established the 'Right to Roam' now enshrined in English law, and a while back I suggested using national lottery money to fund a weekly photo competition for street photography with monthly and annual prizes. I suggested the latter precisely because photographers are an infinitely more valuable resource than CCTV cameras: as an earlier post said, the investigating authorities apparently DID get useful information from members of the public who were carrying cameras and camera 'phones.

    If anyone's interested, a collection of the first couple of years' columns is available from www.magepublishing.co.uk. I'm not totally happy with it -- there are several typos (because I never saw proofs) and the repro quality of picture insert is awful -- but if you like to think about why and how we take pictures, or suffer from low blood pressure, you may find it of interest at only £11.99.

    Cheers,

    R.

  5. #75
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    I've just signed!
    Ultimately,I want to make a legitimate living as a photographer(either freelance or directly employed).
    For that,a qualification will be at the very least extremely useful(possibly even essential).
    For that,I'll need more practice.
    There are only so many good photos I can take in my garden-assuming THAT doesn't qualify as a public place!
    A common mistake people made when designing something completely foolproof was to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

    Computers are incredibly stupid,but they are capable of being incredibly stupid many millions of times a second.

    Both said by Doug Adams

    Only put off until tomorrow that which you are prepared to die having not done-Pablo Picasso

  6. #76
    eagleowl's Avatar
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    Thinking about it a bit more,if this ridiculous piece of proposed legislation goes through,what's to stop it affecting other artists such as painters?
    A common mistake people made when designing something completely foolproof was to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

    Computers are incredibly stupid,but they are capable of being incredibly stupid many millions of times a second.

    Both said by Doug Adams

    Only put off until tomorrow that which you are prepared to die having not done-Pablo Picasso

  7. #77
    Andy K's Avatar
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    ... and what about people with photographic memory?


    -----------My Flickr-----------
    Anáil nathrach, ortha bháis is beatha, do chéal déanaimh.

  8. #78
    David A. Goldfarb's Avatar
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    If this goes through, I predict a massive explosion of pinhole photography in the UK. Anything can be a camera--an Altoids box, beer can, briefcase, pumpkin, delivery truck. If you don't want to be recorded on film, just keep it moving.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
    Photography (not as up to date as the flickr site)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com/photo
    Academic (Slavic and Comparative Literature)--http://www.davidagoldfarb.com

  9. #79
    eagleowl's Avatar
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    I wonder if anyone has thought about forwarding copies of this proposed legislation to the camera,film and memory card manufacturers?
    They'll all be affected by it,and no government can afford to ignore a potential large loss of tax revenue.
    A common mistake people made when designing something completely foolproof was to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools.

    Computers are incredibly stupid,but they are capable of being incredibly stupid many millions of times a second.

    Both said by Doug Adams

    Only put off until tomorrow that which you are prepared to die having not done-Pablo Picasso

  10. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by eagleowl View Post
    Thinking about it a bit more,if this ridiculous piece of proposed legislation goes through,what's to stop it affecting other artists such as painters?
    There is no legislation, I feel quite annoyed as to how this petition has been worded/publicised and think it is more of a hindrance than a help.
    I'm opposed to ludicrous restrictions on taking photos in public places but signing up to something like this doesn't help if it's not based on facts, there is no legislation proposed, nobody is planning any. Exposing the absurd would be more productive and in my previous link referring to the London Eye the publicity itself has done them no favours.

    I've no war stories myself I'm afraid but Dave Gorman has an interesting one (unfortunately not a film shooter).

    The best practice (in my opinion) is to know your rights and use common courtesy.

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