Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 69,771   Posts: 1,516,532   Online: 817
      
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 17
  1. #1

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    431
    Images
    5

    Denver area car show, photo op... 8/27/2011

    I am organizing a classic car get-together this weekend at the free Great Indoors Store meet-up on Saturday from 8am to around 11am. These boys need some real classics to look at as the show is overwhelmingly modern (BMW's, Mercedes, Ferraris, etc. - the tuner crowd). If you have a car, any car you can show - condition does not matter, bring it, or just show up and take photos. It should be a great event to shoot. I will be the one with a white '68 Toronado (and green '69 beater Toronado) and a Pentax 6x7 behemoth. With Cars and Coffee not meeting for who-knows how long, this is a great alternative and should be fun.

    The Great Indoors is in Lone Tree, CO, at I25 and County Line Road (right before E470). Click HERE for a map of the location.
    Mike

    "Your apparent youth belies your worldly knowledge."
    Flickr Account

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Richmond VA.
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    6,710
    I believe the Toronado is one of the first American cars that is front wheel drive.

    Jeff

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    431
    Images
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Kubach View Post
    I believe the Toronado is one of the first American cars that is front wheel drive.

    Jeff
    Well, you'd be correct if you didn't count the 1934 Cord. It was the last until the 1966 Toro came out (with the exception of some very small cars and race cars), though no production front wheel drive was ever as powerful as the 66 Toro - 385HP. The '66 had styling cues from the Cord to pay homage...

    Mine being a 1968 came with 375HP and 500ft/lbs of torque
    Mike

    "Your apparent youth belies your worldly knowledge."
    Flickr Account

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    111
    I think I can make this. I might bring my '82 Porsche 911, but will certainly bring a camera, if I come. Thanks for the heads-up, Mike.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    431
    Images
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by mathomas View Post
    I think I can make this. I might bring my '82 Porsche 911, but will certainly bring a camera, if I come. Thanks for the heads-up, Mike.
    No problem... Hope to see you there Mike, with the Porsche or not! It ought to be a good turnout!

    Mike
    Mike

    "Your apparent youth belies your worldly knowledge."
    Flickr Account

  6. #6
    2F/2F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    8,008
    Images
    4
    Quote Originally Posted by toro_mike View Post
    ...no production front wheel drive was ever as powerful as the 66 Toro - 385HP.
    Not until 1970; the Eldo came with 400/550 hp/torque, respectively.

    But horsepower ratings back then were largely fluff anyhow, as they were gross ratings taken off of the cranks. (They also didn't give much of a hint at actual acceleration capabilities, since they did not factor in the weight of the automobiles, or the gearing. Those 375 horsepower Oldses and Eldos would probably have trouble getting from 0-60 in under 10 seconds unless in the hands of a skilled driver.) When the U.S. auto industry stopped using gross horsepower ratings in the 1970's, the rated horsepower of those 7 and 8 L engines, which had already dropped below 250 due to compression reduction (i.e. smog controls), went down to below 200 due to factoring in the enormous drivetrain losses of the day. That's right: under 200 hp from over 8 L of displacement. They got less power than a modern high-end Honda while displacing over four times as much volume.

    My point is that in order to make that statement, the gross hp rating really needs to be converted to net hp, and compared to all the high-performance front wheel drive cars that have come out in the past 20 years. My guess would be that the 385 hp would be closer to 300, in which case several modern fwd autos have it beat.

    BYW, have fun at the meet. Show those fools what's up.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    431
    Images
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by 2F/2F View Post
    Not until 1970; the Eldo came with 400/550 hp/torque, respectively.

    But horsepower ratings back then were largely fluff anyhow, as they were gross ratings taken off of the cranks. (They also didn't give much of a hint at actual acceleration capabilities, since they did not factor in the weight of the automobiles, or the gearing. Those 375 horsepower Oldses and Eldos would probably have trouble getting from 0-60 in under 10 seconds unless in the hands of a skilled driver.) When the U.S. auto industry stopped using gross horsepower ratings in the 1970's, the rated horsepower of those 7 and 8 L engines, which had already dropped below 250 due to compression reduction (i.e. smog controls), went down to below 200 due to factoring in the enormous drivetrain losses of the day. That's right: under 200 hp from over 8 L of displacement. They got less power than a modern high-end Honda while displacing over four times as much volume.

    My point is that in order to make that statement, the gross hp rating really needs to be converted to net hp, and compared to all the high-performance front wheel drive cars that have come out in the past 20 years. My guess would be that the 385 hp would be closer to 300, in which case several modern fwd autos have it beat.

    BYW, have fun at the meet. Show those fools what's up.
    Thanks! I think it will be a great meet. I'll post photos when I get the film processed. EDIT: I should have said when I process and scan my film!

    You are correct in all that you say, of course. I should have said that none were as powerful BEFORE the 1966 Toro. Also, the 1968 Toronado had a performance package called the W34 package which boosted hp to 400 hp and 500 torque. A touch less torque than the 70 Eldo, but still very impressive. They sadly only made 111 of them, but that engine did go into the Hurst Olds later on in '68. In '69, around 3000 are believed to have been produced.
    Last edited by toro_mike; 08-24-2011 at 10:21 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    Mike

    "Your apparent youth belies your worldly knowledge."
    Flickr Account

  8. #8
    2F/2F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    8,008
    Images
    4
    Just getting into a car discussion, not busting your balls, Mike. I am an old car lover, so I ain't bustin' their balls either! My first car was a '65 Caddy hearse/ambulance combination coach (22 feet long, 3.5 tons, 429 mill), so I love those old boats.
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Englewood, CO
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    431
    Images
    5
    I understood where you were coming from and I appreciate your input and clarification. We old car guys (nuts??) have to stick together

    My first car was a 1969 Olds Ninety Eight, which was ALMOST as big as that hearse! What a car that hearse/ambulance had to have been...
    Thankfully the Toro is a tad smaller...
    Mike

    "Your apparent youth belies your worldly knowledge."
    Flickr Account

  10. #10
    2F/2F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Los Angeles, CA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    8,008
    Images
    4
    I have been out of ownership of an old car since I sold my last one seven years ago. It was a real beauty. A '65 2+2 Mustang that had had a vintage swap done by the original owner (from whom I bought the car). The engine was a rare factory 302 Hi-Po. (I had never even heard of the engine until I got this car; all I knew about were the famous 289 Hi-Po mills.) He had done the proper factory suspension and brake/hub/rear end mods to match (was originally a 6), and it had a three speed stick from a truck. Nice to have the rare engine, even though it was from a later model year, but I wished the car had been original, as that was also a rare combination: 6 cylinder, but instead of the normal 3 speed stick, it had the light duty 4 speed stick that was originally made for Ford's overseas car lines. It was also a very early production fastback, from the first month they were made. Ah, to have back some of the cool stuff I have sold over the years...
    2F/2F

    "Truth and love are my law and worship. Form and conscience are my manifestation and guide. Nature and peace are my shelter and companions. Order is my attitude. Beauty and perfection are my attack."

    - Rob Tyner (1944 - 1991)

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin