Need help with a Zeiss Ikon Maximar 9x12
I'm new to this forum - I tried posting this before but it didn't show up. I need help figuring out how to get started with an old Zeiss Ikon Donata / Maximar folding camera. It looks like it is the Donata version, which from my initial research is only distinguished from the Maximar by how the lateral movement of the lens is accomplished, so for the purpose of this discussion we can call it the more common Maximar.
The opening in the back measures 9x12cm. The compur shutter works fine, the aperture is in amazingly good shape and I cleaned the 135mm Zeiss lens.
I got this camera from my dad over christmas - it once belonged to my great grandfather and came out of my grandmothers estate. I mostly shoot digital and some 35mm film, I also have been learning to refurbish old Nikon AI lenses, but I don't even know the basics of how to take pictures with a sheet film holder, what exactly I need to look for in terms of parts etc.
1. What is easier to find, attach and operate with this camera: roll-film back, film sheet holder? Currently the camera has an old film pack holder attached, I doubt that this type of film pack is still available.
2. Where do I find resources about learning how to shoot with roll-film / sheet film? I've found quite a bit on youtube and in forums, but if anyone knows of a good one-stop source of info, it would be great.
3. Where do I buy? Ebay, Pacific Rim Camera, any other suggestions?
4. Does anyone know which specific parts I may need to get?
Thanks in advance for any help, and pardon my ignorance on the subject. I've done a good bit of digging online but I can't seem to get to the point where I know for sure what I need. I don't want to buy fairly expensive parts that may not fit...
Regarding question 2, I should add that I want to mostly shoot black and white, develop the film myself and then maybe get a film scanner.
You're right, the pack holders are useless. Does it already have a ground-glass back?
9x12 film holders are a bit of a complex world, because there are a bunch of different standards to which they were built. Your best bet may be to find out the Zeiss part number---from googling a bit I think it MAY be 665/7, but I wouldn't bet the farm on that. (Note that Zeiss made several different forms of 9x12 holders, I think because they bought up several smaller companies whose cameras were heterogeneous.)
Rollfilm backs exist, but again you have to find one to fit a Maximar, the backs tend to be expensive, and you only get 6x9 or smaller formats---I think it's more worthwhile to shoot 9x12. Fomapan 100 is fairly easy to find in 9x12 (Freestyle routinely carries it), a few other films are sold in that format in Europe, and I believe the recently released Adox CHS II 100 is supposed to come in it eventually.
I've gotten good service from Pacific Rim Camera; what they will and won't have is very random, but they're a reliable seller and I've always found their descriptions to be accurate. eBay is hit-and-miss as with other things---sometimes you get a bunch of holders in great shape, sometimes they're masses of rust or riddled with light leaks or the wrong fit altogether. Often the best way to get holders is to buy a camera that comes with them.
Shooting large format involves a lot of steps, but none of them are particularly hard. Getting the hang of loading the holders in the dark is the hardest part, I think. Other than that:
1. Point camera at subject
2. Put on ground-glass back
3. Open shutter
4. Disappear under darkcloth and look at ground glass
5. Emerge to tell people to stop laughing at you
6. Go back under and focus until the image looks good
7. Close shutter
8. Try to remove ground-glass back
9. Curse at sticky edges on ground-glass back
10. Pull hard enough that the tripod moves
11. Go back to step 1 and repeat until you get the back off without moving the camera
12. Check that you remembered to close the shutter
13. Insert film holder
14. Set aperture
15. Check that you set the aperture
16. Check again
17. Set shutter speed
18. Dry-fire the shutter to make sure everything is working
19. Make exposure
20. Realize that you forgot to pull the darkslide
21. Pull the darkslide
22. Check that the lens is still stopped down
23. Make exposure for real this time
24. Realize that even with all those checks you STILL forgot to stop the lens down
26. Reinsert darkslide and remove holder
27. Try another holder
28. Remember all the steps this time
29. Explain to spouse, friend, parent, etc. why all this is worth it
30. Tell them again to stop laughing
31. Go home and develop
32. Get a fingerprint in fixer on the negative
33. Curse some more (try another language for variety)
34. Take up painting instead
At least that's my general workflow, but everyone has their own preferences. Don't forget that there's some sort of rule that forces you to wear a cowboy hat when shooting LF landscapes.
San Diego, CA, USA
The lady of the house has to be a pretty swell sort of person to put up with the annoyance of a photographer.
-The Little Technical Library, _Developing, Printing, And Enlarging_
I shoot 9x12 with a couple of old German folders. I think they are wonderful cameras and function really well. Using sheet film with them can be a bit of a challenge for the uninitiated, however, mainly because you not only need to sort out which holders are right for your camera, but you will also need 9x12cm film sheaths that allow you to put sheet film in holders that were originally designed for glass plates.
I would think that a 120 roll film back would be the easiest place to start since it sidesteps the plate holder and film sheath issue entirely. You can easily search Eb@y for one. Rollex, Rada and Suydam were three well known makers of these backs. The trouble is not every seller is knowledgeable and you could end up with a back that is not compatible with your camera. (Trust me, I've been there.) Here's one (LINK) that might fit your camera if it takes the typical thin-rail, slide-in holders.
There is a lot of info on the Web about how to shoot roll and sheet film in general. It is a lot of fun. Enjoy!
In Europe you can get some films and papers custom cut in all sizes you like. It then depends what comes out cheaper or more hassle-free, cutting self of having cut.
Originally Posted by ntenny
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You might glean some good info about 9x12 holders here:
Thanks for the help and suggestions!! Nathan, I enjoyed reading your step by step list... what I'm getting from your and Jonathan's suggestions is that maybe I'll approach this project in 2 steps: starting out with roll film to make it easy on myself and then maybe getting into the 9x12 film sheets. My initial goal is to just be able to take pictures with the camera, and then maybe aiming at higher image quality. Or maybe I'll just see what is available and base my decision on what to start with on that.
Is it possible to focus the camera reasonably without using a ground glass back? Can I set it to infinity, high f-stop and get reasonable images out of it that way?
Thanks for that ebay link, I think from what I've read that one should fit, the current film pack back slides on with rather thin rails...
I have a few 9x12 cameras, cut film is readily available in Europe as it's a standard size, however you do need film inserts for plate holders.
As has been said roll film backs are easy to find and usually very reasonably priced. Just watch you get the right fit whether plate holders or roll film backs as there's many variations.
At the moment I have quite a few roll film backs mostly Rollex but a couple of Rada and only 2 are the same fit, I also have Quarter plate which is close to 9x12 (a touch smaller).
I bought a large box of plate holders just before Christmas and hope to revise th post I made about plate holders in the next few months as I also have some catalogues etc.
Ian, I've checked out your images of all the different backs - quite an extensive collection and great that you are sharing all the info. My impression looking around on ebay is that I need to be patient to find a reasonably priced holder or roll film back that appears to have the right fit, I have seen roll film backs ranging from $10 starting price to $300 buy it now... could you tell me what a reasonabe sale price would be for a Rada Rollfilm back and for plate holders?