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  1. #21
    dasBlute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iogdka View Post
    ...while learning the basics of film photography—from loading cameras and selecting film through film development to film scanning and printing via inkjet and alternative contact print processes like VanDyke Brown.
    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Well, yes and no, because it's a hybrid process workshop, it does belong in DPUG doesn't it?
    Pedanticism kills creativity. This sounds like *exactly* the type of thing that belongs here.

    The LF guys once claimed that 6x17 "wasn't large-format enough"... stuff like that,
    it's just spitting into the wind, no good can come of it, and at best you'll drive away
    kindred souls...

    -Tim

  2. #22

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    Tim,

    Beautiful images in your book, by the way!

    Quote Originally Posted by dasBlute View Post
    Pedanticism kills creativity. This sounds like *exactly* the type of thing that belongs here.

    The LF guys once claimed that 6x17 "wasn't large-format enough"... stuff like that,
    it's just spitting into the wind, no good can come of it, and at best you'll drive away
    kindred souls...

    -Tim
    Critiques Welcome...
    David Aimone Photography

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by iogdka View Post
    Also, I post this here on APUG knowing that many who will read it are at a level where they don't <need> this workshop. But maybe some do, and others could pass it along to someone they know who has been interested in film but hasn't taken the plunge or has only dipped their toes in the water. Either way, it is a chance to promote film photography and to work with others in a beautiful place far from the distractions of the "real" world.

    I'm pretty excited about how good this workshop will be. Since I'm limiting it to 5 attendees, and my expenses are significant to do it on the island, I actually won't be making a lot of money doing this. It will be a small group in an extraordinary location for a reasonable amount of money.

    I'm a bit surprised and saddened about all the negativity here in this forum so far... if you're not interested, that's fine, but I'm doing this because I love doing it and now I have the opportunity...
    I am sorry for my negativity and I do hope some really fun people join this trip of yours.
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  4. #24
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iogdka View Post
    Seriously? If someone shoots and develops film, but they don't make prints with an enlarger, they're not welcome here on APUG?

    Wow! That eliminates most of today's best film photographers out there...most use hybrid techniques to some extent.
    Well, yes I agree, but that the way many on APUG feel, at least as far as discussions on scanning and printing with an ink jet go, they are not slowed here, they tend to ignore when you post scanned negatives etc these days thankfully. APUG is a strange place, but they promote full analog, understand this is the ONLY place on the net that is full analog, every other place has hybrid discussion, so they try to keep it pure photography and no photoshop, it makes sense if you understand the broader picture, it took me forever to accept it. You can go anywhere to discuss ink jet printing or PS tools, but you can only come here to learn about dodging and burning and such from masters of the craft who only use traditional tools. So it's a nice small pocket of folks who are skilled at what they enjoy most about photography, and that's why I and others come here. It's not so bad even if people like me say dumb things...
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Well, yes I agree, but that the way many on APUG feel, at least as far as discussions on scanning and printing with an ink jet go, they are not slowed here, they tend to ignore when you post scanned negatives etc these days thankfully. APUG is a strange place, but they promote full analog, understand this is the ONLY place on the net that is full analog, every other place has hybrid discussion, so they try to keep it pure photography and no photoshop, it makes sense if you understand the broader picture, it took me forever to accept it. You can go anywhere to discuss ink jet printing or PS tools, but you can only come here to learn about dodging and burning and such from masters of the craft who only use traditional tools. So it's a nice small pocket of folks who are skilled at what they enjoy most about photography, and that's why I and others come here. It's not so bad even if people like me say dumb things...
    Stone,

    I appreciate the conversation. Thanks!

    I have an enlarger, and I use it occasionally, but I think that even most film photographers today won't have access to an enlarger without a huge commitment from the start. Hybrid approaches open new opportunities for people to get into film/analog photography without a big investment in a darkroom and an enlarger. Perhaps some of those people with move on to darkroom printing. Others may do contact printing with digital negatives; while others may just scan and print with modern technology. For me, the big difference is still how the various films and older "imperfect" lenses give a character to the image that is still hard to achieve with a modern digital camera and software (though people do try with some success). That's what the workshop is about. I don't personally find as much satisfaction or difference printing with an enlarger. My inkjet prints are almost indistinguishable to my darkroom prints. If I want something that doesn't look perfect, then it's VanDyke, Platinum or another alternative process.

    But it IS nice to know that APUG (and the Large Format Photography Forum) is a refuge for the very traditional methods, that's why I joined. I don't know if I've ever visited DPUG...
    Critiques Welcome...
    David Aimone Photography

  6. #26
    StoneNYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iogdka View Post
    ... My inkjet prints are almost indistinguishable to my darkroom prints...
    Be carful saying that here or you'll get many a retort about how much finer grained a print is by enlargement... I made that mistake once
    ~Stone | "...of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong." ~Dennis Miller

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    Be carful saying that here or you'll get many a retort about how much finer grained a print is by enlargement... I made that mistake once
    I will be mindful of that controversy and lay low on that subject. Thanks!
    Critiques Welcome...
    David Aimone Photography

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by iogdka View Post
    I just thought Stone was being sarcastic....

    Anyway, thanks Michael. I go back to the island every year now that my brother, an artist, has a place there. Great variety of locations and ever changing conditions on that small island 10 miles out to sea!

    We are converting the first floor of his house from a store to a studio/gallery this spring. No darkroom but it should be a great place to work out of with lots of work space. I'm going to leave the agenda flexible to take advantage of the best outdoor conditions, while spending the rest of the time working in the studio-- discussing, developing, scanning and printing.

    We'll be developing with caffenol, pyrocat and maybe Rodinal. Beside developing, I'll have a scanner, an inkjet printer and we'll use the sun for a uv light source with van dykes. We may even produce a digital negative or two if we have the time.

    I will have medium and large format cameras and film, as well as pinhole cameras at both sizes.

    Attachment 79982
    this sounds like a blast.

    have fun with your workshop !

    john
    im empty, good luck

  9. #29
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    David:

    Good luck with your workshop.

    It is probably true that if it didn't have any of the alternative printing items in it it would be outside of APUG's focus, but that wouldn't mean that most here on APUG think that it would be bad.

    If there was a digital component to everything you do, it would just be that APUG wouldn't think that it was particularly suitable for discussion on APUG. And you might be asked not to advertise the workshop - but most likely not.

    By limiting the subjects on APUG, the site has kept itself very focused, and as a result healthy.

    A lot of APUG members are familiar with or use some digital methods - they just know not to discuss that stuff here.

    There are quite a number of members who choose to darkroom print all their black and white work, and don't do alternative photography printing. Obviously, they are not your target market.
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

  10. #30

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    I've been a member of APUG for some time now, but haven't been that active. I very much appreciate this site and I've had a bit of an education on its mission here in the past day. I think I'll add 4x5" Silver Gelatin Contact Prints to the workshop agenda, then we'll be totally good to go, right?

    65,000+ members. That's impressive.
    Critiques Welcome...
    David Aimone Photography

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