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  1. #11

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  2. #12

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    Fair enough, although I always thought that the reason R&D was spent on improving film was because it filtered down from movie film, was this the case with Fuji?

    Am I right about Imax though?

  3. #13
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    R&D dollars did not filter down from any one source. In fact, even today the second biggest seller by EK and Fuji are their color papers. At one time, I would guess that color paper and movie film both sold equally well. That was probably in the 70s.

    PE

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    I was under the impression that the reason why technical improvements had been made in film emulsions in the last few years have been made because technological advancements in motion picture stocks, where it was still quite competitive, had filtered down to still films. I also thought that Fuji would have been selling more motion picture film than still film, no?

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajuk View Post
    I was under the impression that the reason why technical improvements had been made in film emulsions in the last few years have been made because technological advancements in motion picture stocks, where it was still quite competitive, had filtered down to still films. I also thought that Fuji would have been selling more motion picture film than still film, no?
    The movie industry is VERY slow to change, a lot of that has to do with money. For example, Hollywood in general has been using Kodak film stock more than any other. Even if Fuji was somehow slightly better, they wouldn't risk switching systems because the risk of processing a whole movie and having the result come out differently than planned because of a new and unfamiliar film is too great a risk. So Kodak cornered that market long ago.

    I work in the industry and though I'm not involved in that side per-se I work with those guys enough to know I'm pretty much on target with this statement.

    They would prefer to use something that is tested even if of lesser quality because they can guarantee the result. With $100,000,000 dollars on the table, changing films isn't easy.

  6. #16
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    Well, actually, the image stability improvements moved from color paper (which drove image stability for years) back to MP print films and camera originals for archiving the original color footage. You see, the archiving of digital images became very difficult and expensive. You will see that both EK and Fuji have come out with new archival MP films.

    Also, Fuji's contribution to MP was miniscule compared to EK, but in terms of their overall production it was large. EK was by far the biggest supplier.

    PE

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Well, actually, the image stability improvements moved from color paper (which drove image stability for years) back to MP print films and camera originals for archiving the original color footage. You see, the archiving of digital images became very difficult and expensive. You will see that both EK and Fuji have come out with new archival MP films.

    Also, Fuji's contribution to MP was miniscule compared to EK, but in terms of their overall production it was large. EK was by far the biggest supplier.

    PE
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by StoneNYC View Post
    The movie industry is VERY slow to change, a lot of that has to do with money. For example, Hollywood in general has been using Kodak film stock more than any other. Even if Fuji was somehow slightly better, they wouldn't risk switching systems because the risk of processing a whole movie and having the result come out differently than planned because of a new and unfamiliar film is too great a risk. So Kodak cornered that market long ago.

    I work in the industry and though I'm not involved in that side per-se I work with those guys enough to know I'm pretty much on target with this statement.

    They would prefer to use something that is tested even if of lesser quality because they can guarantee the result. With $100,000,000 dollars on the table, changing films isn't easy.
    Plenty of tv shows, movies, and commercials have been shot on fujifilm. Often it was due to cost savings but also for the particular look being sought. No one shoots a "new film" for a project w/o testing so there aren't suprises. Kodak changes thie emulsions quite frequently and no one would shoot it for a serious job w/o testing (which is always done on feature films). kodak's films were inferior to fuji's, cinematographers wouldn't switch?
    Both companies make/made some great films but choosing one over the other has nothing to do with "changing systems."
    Last edited by wildbill; 02-04-2013 at 12:27 AM. Click to view previous post history.
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  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildbill View Post
    Plenty of tv shows, movies, and commercials have been shot on fujifilm. Often it was due to cost savings but also for the particular look being sought. No one shoots a "new film" for a project w/o testing so there aren't suprises. Kodak changes thie emulsions quite frequently and no one would shoot it for a serious job w/o testing (which is always done on feature films). kodak's films were inferior to fuji's, cinematographers wouldn't switch?
    Both companies make/made some great films but choosing one over the other has nothing to do with "changing systems."
    you're right... sort of ... it's about how MANAGEMENT views it... all they know is they have always used Kodak... so changing doesn't mean much to the money men, they just want to stick with what works... it's a slow mentality of change... just how the movie industry works. We should be glad... if they weren't so slow to change, they wouldn't use ANY film lol

  10. #20
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    The cinematographers and SFX people used to visit Kodak research and show us what was wrong with the films and how to improve them in terms of speed and curve shape (using the best examples).

    To illustrate, the Dmax of ECN and the interneg films were just fine until all of these SF movies came along and then ILM found that there was not enough black for outer space SFX, and so space was gray! They used a work around, but came to EK to plead for more Dmax, which meant a longer tone scale. We did it.

    Along the way, they showed us outcuts from some SF movies with SFX "bloopers". They also ran some footage at slow speed to show "bloopers" that were left in the final films, because the human eye could not see them at projection speed.

    Anyhow, just another reason to use Kodak film... The cooperative effort with Hollywood people. We even had a KRL office in Hollywood staffed by 2 or more KRL engineers to help them.

    Fuji did not!

    PE

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