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  1. #81

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    I find I promote film use the best when I am not on the internet but out shooting, carrying my little 5x7 folio of hand made prints. APUG is not what gets people looking at choosing film again, it is where they go once they decide to explore it, if they can even find the site, usually by word of mouth.
    This site and especially the photos that reside on it are largely invisible to most of the world and I think that PE's citation of metrics is probably correct. Those who become re-engaged in the craft of using film usually have done so because they were inspired by something or someone, like an NYT Lens blog article, a showing of fine prints, seeing someone under the dark cloth or seeing better than usual work on flickr.

    There are some spectacular images being made on the last three iterations of iPhones and like it or not, if they were printed to 16x20, their sheer impact would far outdistance a lot of the work being shown on this site. So this is what the reality is, the smartphone has readily taken the place of the SLR, compact or point and shoot as the cash cow of memories and you can be an old washed up codger all you want and say that they will lose their memories but that will not change what has happened or what will continue to happen to the availability and price of film.

    Film use is super-niche and the market is still adjusting to that, never to be a super-market item ever again. So instead of bitching, maybe get some real prints into someone's hands for them to look at when you are out shooting....and no, sorry, not computer prints born of scans, they will not convince someone to use film like you think they will. For when it comes right down to it, the guy is going to say "but I get just as good a print from my iPhone 5S" and he will be right...

    Getting off of here and out shooting and showing work is the only way to promote one of the best reasons to use film, not being on a computer..

    Oh, and about the choice of name for this site, it is terrible, sounds like a "A-Pug", a dog, **really** piss poor when it comes to promoting film. Google filmphotography.com, not even in use although grossly overpriced, drop the last letter and it is a bargain so buy the damn URL and have it link back to this site, can you do that with MY money please?

    Something, anything else to direct traffic to the site because the name is horrid in terms of finding the site Sean…not one single pro or very few amateurs I have encountered have even heard of it.
    Last edited by PKM-25; 03-10-2014 at 12:35 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaf-Photo View Post
    Again, I think it's a matter of complaicency on the part of the manufacturers.

    I notice that more and more people become interested in photography because they have started taking photos with their phones. They want a real camera to take better pictures.
    Yep. That was me, nearly a decade ago.
    From a 2Mp state-of-the-art phone camera to a DSLR and moving up the chain to film.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaf-Photo View Post
    for many people the learning curve from instagraming snapshots with presets, to editing raw files in Lightroom is too great. I've had to help quite a lot of people undrstand the workflow. Unfortunately, many of them think it's too much work.

    That's one of the problems with analogue film today. Apart from a few pro labs, it'll take a couple of weeks to have a film developed. And the scans are usually very poor. Most people are not interested in investing time and money into developing or scanning at home.

    I think the manufacturers really should take some steps to make life easier for the transition customers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nuff View Post
    If someone can come up with correctly priced product which offers development, scan and internet upload, a lot more of the Instagram generation people would pick it up. But none of the current manufacturers is even aware of sites like Facebook, Twitter or Instagram. Not to mention how to integrate their services with them.

    Drop of your film and few hours later it's on Facebook or Flickr. It can't be that hard!

    Indeed.
    Lomo is doing it's bit in documenting stuff like this but a film manufacturer consortium + camera makers would really benefit majorly from it.

    There might be more negatives about food or babies, but definitely would win over a few converts.

    Then again, Nikon already has a similarly working digital SLR in the 3300 so you know where their bread's buttered


    Sent from Tap-a-talk

  3. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by PKM-25 View Post
    I find I promote film use the best when I am not on the internet but out shooting, carrying my little 5x7 folio of hand made prints. APUG is not what gets people looking at choosing film again, it is where they go once they decide to explore it, if they can even find the site, usually by word of mouth.
    This site and especially the photos that reside on it are largely invisible to most of the world and I think that PE's citation of metrics is probably correct. Those who become re-engaged in the craft of using film usually have done so because they were inspired by something or someone, like an NYT Lens blog article, a showing of fine prints, seeing someone under the dark cloth or seeing better than usual work on flickr.

    There are some spectacular images being made on the last three iterations of iPhones and like it or not, if they were printed to 16x20, their sheer impact would far outdistance a lot of the work being shown on this site. So this is what the reality is, the smartphone has readily taken the place of the SLR, compact or point and shoot as the cash cow of memories and you can be an old washed up codger all you want and say that they will lose their memories but that will not change what has happened.

    Film use is niche and the market is still adjusting to that. So instead of bitching, maybe get some real prints into someone's hands for them to look at when you are out shooting....and no, sorry, not computer prints born of scans, they will not convince someone to use film like you think they will. For when it comes right down to it, the guy is going to say "but I get just as good a print from my iPhone 5S" and he will be right...

    Getting off of here and out shooting and showing work is the only way to promote one of the best reasons to use film, not being on a computer..

    Oh, and about the choice of name for this site, it is terrible, sounds like a "A-Pug", a dog, **really** piss poor when it comes to promoting film. Google filmphotography.com, not even in use although grossly overpriced, drop the last letter and it is a bargain so buy the damn URL and have it link back to this site, can you do that with MY money please?

    Something, anything else to direct traffic to the site because the name is horrid in terms of finding the site Sean…not one single pro or very few amateurs I have encountered have even heard of it.
    I'm not sure who you mean be pros but the pros I know have heard of APUG and few even have a presence here (albeit extremely limited). Also, I wouldn't want it to be called "filmphotography" because that invites all the hybrid people who inexplicably shoot film and then scan it for digital printing, to incessantly post questions about scanning.

  4. #84
    MDR
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    PKM is mostly right people should be invited to see the wonders of film and the quality of film unfortunately people often assume that images that were made using analogue material was made using digital cameras. Baryta paper is not the domain of analogue photography anymore there is Baryta paper for inkjet and there is Baryta paper for laser/led systems like the lambda. What is inherently analogue these days and more what makes film better choice than digital these days? Us film guys are fighting an uphill battle and we are loosing ground for the simple reason that the masses do not care about the things that make film great.

    Quality: Ha who needs quality, quality never was that important otherwise movies would still be shot in 65mm and pro photographers would mostly use 8x10 cameras

    Archivability: Ha since the advent of the minilab the archivability of film materials has become a joke sorry the quick lab/mini lab is an archivability killer

    Soul: Ha who needs that non scientific hogwash even soul music doesn't really sell that well.

    Real world high res vs fake high res: People look at the numbers not the output so again nobody cares again see quality points about 65mm and 8x10

    The sad truth is that those important things are not important anymore if they ever were that is.

    And now to the important part of my post:
    PKM showing his little Portofolio is the only way to help film it's probably not the images that work but PKM's enthusiasm that draws people in and makes them try film. We should go out and show our enthusiasm to the world film is great film is magic, film is different and cool.

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R 1974 View Post
    I'm not sure who you mean be pros but the pros I know have heard of APUG and few even have a presence here (albeit extremely limited). Also, I wouldn't want it to be called "filmphotography" because that invites all the hybrid people who inexplicably shoot film and then scan it for digital printing, to incessantly post questions about scanning.
    You are missing the point, it would be to direct traffic to the site, not replace the name. And say he did use the URL from the outset, how in the hell does a name invite hybrid if the policy dictates otherwise? The site policies dictate the terms, not the name...

  6. #86

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    Quote Originally Posted by MDR View Post
    And now to the important part of my post:
    PKM showing his little Portofolio is the only way to help film it's probably not the images that work but PKM's enthusiasm that draws people in and makes them try film. We should go out and show our enthusiasm to the world film is great film is magic, film is different and cool.
    Yeah, kind of...

    I still show fantastic work that would make even the best "Photo-shopper" second guess his reasons for doing so, the impact of the image carries the interest most of the time. In one case in my office in town, I have a 16"x16" of this print up on the wall on a mantle not in a frame and there is a little sign below it that says "Touch Me" so it encourages people to handle it, feel the thing and engage with it.

    When someone sees a nice silver gel print of a killer image in their hand in the sunlight gleaming back at them, it's pretty darn convincing folks...

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by PKM-25 View Post
    I find I promote film use the best when I am not on the internet but out shooting, carrying my little 5x7 folio of hand made prints. APUG is not what gets people looking at choosing film again, it is where they go once they decide to explore it, if they can even find the site, usually by word of mouth.
    This site and especially the photos that reside on it are largely invisible to most of the world and I think that PE's citation of metrics is probably correct. Those who become re-engaged in the craft of using film usually have done so because they were inspired by something or someone, like an NYT Lens blog article, a showing of fine prints, seeing someone under the dark cloth or seeing better than usual work on flickr.

    There are some spectacular images being made on the last three iterations of iPhones and like it or not, if they were printed to 16x20, their sheer impact would far outdistance a lot of the work being shown on this site. So this is what the reality is, the smartphone has readily taken the place of the SLR, compact or point and shoot as the cash cow of memories and you can be an old washed up codger all you want and say that they will lose their memories but that will not change what has happened or what will continue to happen to the availability and price of film.

    Film use is super-niche and the market is still adjusting to that, never to be a super-market item ever again. So instead of bitching, maybe get some real prints into someone's hands for them to look at when you are out shooting....and no, sorry, not computer prints born of scans, they will not convince someone to use film like you think they will. For when it comes right down to it, the guy is going to say "but I get just as good a print from my iPhone 5S" and he will be right...

    Getting off of here and out shooting and showing work is the only way to promote one of the best reasons to use film, not being on a computer..

    Oh, and about the choice of name for this site, it is terrible, sounds like a "A-Pug", a dog, **really** piss poor when it comes to promoting film. Google filmphotography.com, not even in use although grossly overpriced, drop the last letter and it is a bargain so buy the damn URL and have it link back to this site, can you do that with MY money please?

    Something, anything else to direct traffic to the site because the name is horrid in terms of finding the site Sean…not one single pro or very few amateurs I have encountered have even heard of it.
    Totally agree and as an aside "cash cow of memories" needs to be a thing. Love it.

  8. #88
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    Dan EXUDES enthusiasm. I think that anyone who has met him knows that.

    But, most Pros that I know are either too busy being pros, or disdain APUG as being a site for newbies (this includes other similar web sites). And, since the Pros are experts, they don't like arguments, which are all too often on this and other web sites. Differences of opinion yes, arguments no!

    And many Pros either don't want to help or don't care, or have gone digital.

    Sorry APUGGERS.

    PE

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by eddie View Post
    I've had many similar experiences, Ken. I've never said no either. I can't count how many times I've put someone under the dark cloth. I've also explained what I'm shooting, how I'm metering, and what I plan for the finished image, for those interested. I'm not looking for converts... just hoping people learn there are people who care about their craft, even if their craft is seen as archaic and has been (seemingly) marginalized. Sharing one's passion is fun...
    I neglected to mention that due to a curiosity question once from a young lady* I now also carry with me a retired 8x10 film holder loaded with a throw-away sheet. It's used as a prop during my standard spiel to help illustrate what's actually happening with that huge contraption.

    If they're brave enough to ask and interested enough to listen, I'll always give a short age/technically-appropriate explanation of what I'm doing. People are fascinated and usually love listening to it.

    (And no, I'm not a surveyor. But that's a really good guess...)



    Ken

    * A foreign student attending Washington State University. Part of a group of 6 or 8 who were wondering just what the heck was going on. The 8x10 was set up on the canyon rim at Palouse Falls early one morning after I spent the night in 20F/-7C cold in a sleeping bag in my truck. The pictures eventually sucked. But the adventure was great.
    "Hate is an adolescent term used to stop discussion with people you disagree with. You can do better than that."
    —'blanksy', December 13, 2013

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    But, most Pros that I know are either too busy being pros, or disdain APUG as being a site for newbies (this includes other similar web sites). And, since the Pros are experts, they don't like arguments, which are all too often on this and other web sites. Differences of opinion yes, arguments no!

    And many Pros either don't want to help or don't care, or have gone digital.
    I have very little patience in life for people who exhibit this attitude. In any profession or field of endeavor or expertise. As the Queen once allegedly understated, we are not amused. Best to just step around such egos and keep moving forward...

    Ken
    Last edited by Ken Nadvornick; 03-10-2014 at 02:43 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    "Hate is an adolescent term used to stop discussion with people you disagree with. You can do better than that."
    —'blanksy', December 13, 2013



 

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