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  1. #11
    Guillaume Zuili's Avatar
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    PE, what about the change of plant for the Tri-x ? Even if it's different today (very marginal for me) it's still there. Why a slightly different paper isn't possible ?

  2. #12
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Hey, I'm just saying that it will be different and may not work at all.

    IDK. I hope for the best.

    PE

  3. #13

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    Agfa

    PE-we know what you know-now let's all sit in a large circle and have a group prayer. Someone somewhere has to step to the plate or the matrials WILL die out for us. Let's face it the internet has changed everything and whoever was running Agfa was a bunch of morons/and greedy mother something or other...
    It may be hard but not impossible or else we'll all be coating our own glass plates!!! Let's have some positive nergy here folks. Think positive!!!
    Best to all of you analogue boys and girls!!
    Peter

  4. #14
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Peter;

    Nice to hear from you. I agree! I wish I could help them, but I know from nothing about Agfa methodology.

    Best to you. Start making and coating! What is your excuse?

    Ron

  5. #15
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    I don't think it's a matter of negativity.

    I just don't see what the big deal is bringing out a product with the Agfa name on it. At this point it is just a brandname - nothing more than that.

    If you're into nostalgia then perhaps you will get a warm, fuzzy "feel good" over buying a box of paper with the Agfa name and logo on it. But that's all you're going to get.

    The firm has been dead for quite a while. Whatever workforce remained at the end (likely quite aging) has dispersed. It's more likely than not that some "vulture investor" group has now come in to buy the brandname (for paper products at least) and the old French factory on the cheap.

    The idea is for the buyers to try to squeeze the last bit of milk out of this otherwise dry cow and hope what they earn exceeds what they're paying for a distressed asset sale! They are counting on nostalgia - because its almost certain they have nothing new to offer.

    [The fact that this scenario may be a prelude to the decline and demise of other film photography and related products manufacturers is something only time will reveal.]

  6. #16

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    Historically, what Agfa b/w papers were coated in France? I was under the impression that all the b/w paper coating during my lifetime in Photography, (1960's to present) were from Germany? But I am in the USA. Perhaps that is all that was exported. What plant in France would still be extant with equipment in place?

  7. #17
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    PE, it's not that I don't believe you. I have no expertise in this field. I do know it takes about 3 years for a world-class pulp mill to reach it's design capacity and quality (and 3/4 billion $). One of the differences between this and photo paper factory is that the pulp mill can sell off it's below-standard stuff at a reduced price.

    I think I understand why it would be difficult to make exactly the same product they were making before the shut-down. But how about a "new, good, similar" product? In spite of the difficulties you mention, it has been done before. I am not trying to argue with you when I ask what is different now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Ask Fuji why the new film they are "RESTARTING" is not the same.

    Johnny, all you other guys. I've been trying to tell you that analog film making is a heartbreakingly difficult thing to do and once you start you dare not stop. Once you do, you can never go back.

    You just don't believe me. Well, the Fuji evidence is all I can offer outside of my own experiences. Sorry. I've been there and done that! There are so few of us in the world that can say that, that it is no wonder that this problem is so misunderstood.

    When I went back to visit one of my professors of Biochemistry and described this process to him, he said "My God, it is like desiging a human being from scratch it is so complex, and all done at the micron scale and at high speed".

    PE
    Last edited by johnnywalker; 01-09-2007 at 01:13 AM. Click to view previous post history.
    If I had been present at the creation, I would have given some useful hints for the better arrangement of the Universe.
    Alfonso the Wise, 1221-1284

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by PHOTOTONE View Post
    Historically, what Agfa b/w papers were coated in France? I was under the impression that all the b/w paper coating during my lifetime in Photography, (1960's to present) were from Germany? But I am in the USA. Perhaps that is all that was exported. What plant in France would still be extant with equipment in place?
    I know they did something with paper in France, but I was told by an Agfa employee that they only cut and boxed paper there. If you had seen the paper coating equipment in Germany, you would understand that it makes no sense to have another coating facility in France.
    If you're not taking your camera...there's no reason to travel. --APUG member bgilwee

  9. #19
    ath
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    Hi,

    fyi, the information Ralph cites came from Wolf Rainer Schmalfuss (posting here as WRSchmalfuss). He works (at least part time or as freelancer) for MACO.

    IMHO this has the same basis as this thread: http://www.apug.org/forums/forum172/...m-anybody.html, just used as Maco Marketing.

    I think, Mirko said all, what is to say today.

    Regards,
    Andreas

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by PHOTOTONE View Post
    Historically, what Agfa b/w papers were coated in France? I was under the impression that all the b/w paper coating during my lifetime in Photography, (1960's to present) were from Germany? But I am in the USA. Perhaps that is all that was exported. What plant in France would still be extant with equipment in place?

    I'd have thought the Gevaert plant in Belgium was a likelier candidate, as they are still in operation (coating, among other things, aero films, one of which is cut down as Maco Scanfilm).

    Since Guilleminot went under, I know of no paper coating line in France.

    Cheers,

    R.

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