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  1. #251
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Denise;

    Thanks for an excellent post.

    You have seen what is out there, but I am going by the APUG member reaction so I don't dispute what you have said from your real experiences. As for E-mail, I seem to attract the cranks. About half of my email is great and comes from enthusiastic people, but the other half can be divided into those convinced that digital is the only way out, disputing my efforts (and yours sometimes), and the other part are outright cranks, some claiming that my images are fakes. Well, in the face of your excellent results, I point them to your web site! That should cure them!

    Keep up the good work!

    PE

  2. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by dwross View Post
    I applaud your determination! You're going to have a blast. And, I think you'll have more company than you suspect. PE counts 5 people making emulsions on APUG. I can think of more than that, and I'm pretty sure the number is growing at an increasing rate -- along with the quality of the initial efforts. I'm particularly optimistic for the younger crowd. They seem to have shed the idea that we have to compete with modern technology (at least to get started!) Preconceived notions can be the real killer of creativity and invention. Good luck, Nikanon!
    Thanks for the encouragement. It'[s heartening to know that there are others. And the digital age makes sharing ten thousand times easier than our fore-bearers had it in the 19th century.

    Quote Originally Posted by dwross View Post
    PE, the fact that practicing emulsionmakers are a small crowd right now shouldn't be seen as a deterrent to your excellent technical posts. Information landing and taking root in just one individual is as valid as a bestseller. And, again, and if the emails that I get are any indication, a lot of people are interested in emulsionmaking. They just need encouragement and information. They might not become cooks overnight. Sometimes things have to come together over time, but come together they do if there's fire in the belly.
    This kind of what I would love to see as well PE. While my experience is mostly from manufacturing, much like Steve's comment earlier, I'm not the kind of guy who developed the process. I upscale and mechanize processes that research guys have developed. I do believe that I could build a working coating line if I won the lottery, but I don't know how to coat!

    If we collaborate, so that the ones who know the chemistry share that, then those of us who are good at implementation can work developing the work flow.

    I dare say that in time we could come up with a "cook-book" with scores of recipes that any determined hobbyist could replicate with effort. We would need both the ingredients and the methodology, plus explanations how to organize the kitchen.
    Michael Batchelor
    Industrial Informatics, Inc.
    www.industrialinformatics.com

    The camera catches light. The photographer catches life.

  3. #253
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    I find the discussion of emulsion making highly interesting. I never considered it something that anyone would be doing. I think it's cool that right nearby where I live there's a guy called wildbillbugman doing this interesting stuff. Even though I'm not into it at this time, who knows about the future. It's all part of the spectrum of interests represented here.
    I do use a digital device in my photographic pursuits when necessary.
    When someone rags on me for using film, I use a middle digit, upraised.

  4. #254
    lxdude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ektagraphic View Post
    I'm not trying to me a jerk PE, but Merrium Webster just told me that:

    Good- d (1) : of a noticeably large size or quantity : considerable

    That's where I was coming from.
    I was going to tease you about it but PE beat me to it.
    I do use a digital device in my photographic pursuits when necessary.
    When someone rags on me for using film, I use a middle digit, upraised.

  5. #255
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Well, for lab scale and for larger scale, you need a good method of coating that is inexpensive and reliable. Jim Browning's method is slow but reliable and usable. It is not inexpensive. It will make good film sheets up to 30x40 inches on film or paper. I have done it personally at Jim's under his tutelage.

    For lab scale and larger, you need a good method to make emulsions and to do that you need a good mixer (not a good stirrer - unless you are working at very small scale) and you need reliable temperature control from about 40 - 80 degrees C. In addition, you need a lab full of chemicals suited to your destination emulsion and you need a refrigerator to keep your emulsions cold. You need a good washing method for the emulsion, including noodle wash, ISO wash and UF wash. These are all in posts here with pictures.

    And, you need good support such as glass plates, subbed film, and a suitable paper. I have been using Strathmore papers, hot press at 100# or higher or baryta paper. The baryta is no longer available from the Formulary and IDK what the plans are for the future.

    That summarizes things for starters. All of these are described in long threads here on APUG.

    PE

  6. #256
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelbsc View Post

    If we collaborate, so that the ones who know the chemistry share that, then those of us who are good at implementation can work developing the work flow.

    I dare say that in time we could come up with a "cook-book" with scores of recipes that any determined hobbyist could replicate with effort. We would need both the ingredients and the methodology, plus explanations how to organize the kitchen.
    That is the mission statement of The Light Farm. We've been up and at it for two and a half years now. Here's some info on our contributors to date:

    http://thelightfarm.com/Map/Contribu...utorsPart1.htm.

    Jim Browning has a link to his own juicy-with-information website, and Kevin Klein and Mark Osterman (of George Eastman House) have their own sections for their recipes. Bill Winkler (aka 'wildbillbugman') has written the definitive article on glass cleaning. If TLF were a book, it would be hundreds of pages by now.

    The beauty of web publishing is that there is no limit to how many pages we can have, so if you make an emulsion, and would like to be part of a collaboration that is trying to 'rescue' handcrafted silver gelatin emulsions, I enthusiastically invite you to become a Light Farm contributor, either directly (I'll give you your own section!) or with a link to your own site.

    One last, very important note: Antique artisan emulsions can be exceedingly simple affairs requiring the bare minimum of equipment and only a few chemicals. Remember, the first emulsions were made before electricity and George Eastman started Kodak with dry plates he made in his mother's kitchen

    Cheers!

  7. #257
    Steve Smith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelbsc View Post
    While my experience is mostly from manufacturing, much like Steve's comment earlier, I'm not the kind of guy who developed the process. I upscale and mechanize processes that research guys have developed. I do believe that I could build a working coating line if I won the lottery, but I don't know how to coat!

    If we collaborate, so that the ones who know the chemistry share that, then those of us who are good at implementation can work developing the work flow.
    That's exactly what is needed as one person will probably not have the knowledge to do all of it. I'm certain that I could build a web (roll to roll) emulsion coating machine although I certainly could not afford to do so.

    Whilst I also think I could probably get to the stage of making emulsion, I don't think I ever will. I probably don't have the patience for it.


    Steve.
    "People who say things won't work are a dime a dozen. People who figure out how to make things work are worth a fortune" - Dave Rat.

  8. #258
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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post

    For example, on a good week, cine products may run for a full day for several days, C41 takes up a day or two, and E6 products may run every other week. On that same scale, Kodachrome ran once a year! The difference is that the E6 product then sells to customers right away.
    Very interesting. I wouldn't have even thought that C-41 and E-6 would run this often but I guess there are quite a few people in the world.
    Helping to save analog photography one exposure at a time

  9. #259
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    Those are just my own guesstimates and not real figures! They are only to be used as very rough examples.

    PE

  10. #260
    CGW
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    Last edited by CGW; 09-13-2010 at 01:56 PM. Click to view previous post history.



 

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