Switch to English Language Passer en langue franšaise Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 75,145   Posts: 1,658,120   Online: 673
      
Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 74
  1. #51
    michaelbsc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    South Carolina
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    2,106
    Images
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer
    Well, this was the problem with Kodak's model and that of just about every other film company. Large countries like Brazil and China as well as parts of Africa just jumped into digital and bypassed analog. The Kodak model said B&W analog -> color analog -> digital, but the analog was bypassed due to the huge drop in prices of digital items.

    PE
    My conjecture was based on watching plants implement control systems. A "new" roll out in an existing plant is likely to use legacy technology. But a new plant is likely to use new technology. Likewise I expect new markets are likely to embrace new technology unless the new technology is prohibitively priced.

    This is pure conjecture in my part. I have no research to back it up.
    Michael Batchelor
    Industrial Informatics, Inc.
    www.industrialinformatics.com

    The camera catches light. The photographer catches life.

  2. #52
    keithwms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Charlottesville, Virginia
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    6,075
    Blog Entries
    20
    Images
    129
    Quote Originally Posted by michaelbsc View Post
    I have no research to back it up.
    For the record, me neither. I am curious to hear from those inside China and India whether they are really going straight to digital. Last I hear, i thought fuji was doing quite well there with instant film.
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

    [APUG Portfolio] [APUG Blog] [Website]

  3. #53
    keithwms's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Charlottesville, Virginia
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    6,075
    Blog Entries
    20
    Images
    129
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray Rogers View Post
    Yesterday I saw an ad for a report that China was behind the surge in the price of silver...
    Hmm, I wonder why that'd be. I know that it is still widely used in electronics and currency and of course jewelry. And they don't really have much of a photographic industry, do they? I thought industrial use of silver was in sharp decline. Something like a third of all mined silver used to go to the photography sector.

    I wonder if it's just being bought up as an inflation hedge... I thought most of that hedge buying was for gold.

    My uninformed guess is that the Chinese are worried about their currency in the long term; it's not really got a firm basis and they are still quite reliant on the dollar as a benchmark. My understanding is that they don't even have a treasury and central bank structure and so the renminbi's value is still set by some sort of group of old guys sitting around a card table. If that's true then they'd be wise to use their cash to buy up gold and silver. Previously they'd just stash dollars, but with recent events and the threat of big inflation in the US, gold and silver make a lot of sense.
    "Only dead fish follow the stream"

    [APUG Portfolio] [APUG Blog] [Website]

  4. #54

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    268
    Quote Originally Posted by keithwms View Post
    For the record, me neither. I am curious to hear from those inside China and India whether they are really going straight to digital. Last I hear, i thought fuji was doing quite well there with instant film.
    I lived in Shanghai for 4 years. The vast vast majority had some digital form of camera. Most simply used their cell phones.

  5. #55
    michaelbsc's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    South Carolina
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    2,106
    Images
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by dfoo
    Quote Originally Posted by keithwms View Post
    For the record, me neither. I am curious to hear from those inside China and India whether they are really going straight to digital. Last I hear, i thought fuji was doing quite well there with instant film.
    I lived in Shanghai for 4 years. The vast vast majority had some digital form of camera. Most simply used their cell phones.
    How about smalle places?

    How many towns are 10K-30K people with older infrastructure?
    Michael Batchelor
    Industrial Informatics, Inc.
    www.industrialinformatics.com

    The camera catches light. The photographer catches life.

  6. #56
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    24,431
    Images
    65
    Quote Originally Posted by michaelbsc View Post
    My conjecture was based on watching plants implement control systems. A "new" roll out in an existing plant is likely to use legacy technology. But a new plant is likely to use new technology. Likewise I expect new markets are likely to embrace new technology unless the new technology is prohibitively priced.

    This is pure conjecture in my part. I have no research to back it up.
    Michael;

    I have to state that prices on digital items dropped so fast that a plant was obsolete before built. A case in point is the Kodak DVD and CD plant in Ireland. I left EK when it was just starting and one of my guys went to work on the project. He said that the price per unit was X but by the time the plant was built and on-line the price was 1/10 X and therefore the plant had to be redesigned at great cost. Finally, I believe that it went out of production. Now, you might argue that this was bad planning - well, I agree, but it illustrates the problem with the market. Prices drop so fast in digital that plants can become obsolete and the smaller players (read EK perhaps in this case - or maybe their model was off? ) can be burned badly.

    PE

  7. #57

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    OH
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    1,787
    Images
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by michaelbsc View Post
    How about smalle places?

    How many towns are 10K-30K people with older infrastructure?
    Are there that many small towns in China of only 20k people?

    When I was in China in 2005, before I started shooting film, I had absolutely no problems finding photo places (with Kodak branding all over them) that would dump my memory cards to CD for me. Of course this was in a small city of about 3,000,000 people, but it's one that most westerners probably haven't heard of.

  8. #58
    Aristophanes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    505
    Images
    15
    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    China was and remains a huge market for digital kiosks due to the fact that many people have no phones or computers.
    The vast majority of the developing world has no access to a PC, period. Photos are processed digitally via kiosk or on the cloud (Flickr). Printing is an exceedingly rare afterthought.

    I lived in West and Southern Africa in the 1990's, pre-digital, and I could get film and batteries in many places. People did not have landline telephones, but they were into film for decades. When celphones came out they made the leap and those have now become their cameras and PC's. Absent landlines and cableTV high speed broadband is not a fixture of the developing world (that and horrendous telecom monopolies). The internet cafe has been the workaround.

    Most DSLR's have in-camera processing precisely because the majority of the new market will not use a PC to process. Nor do they have mini-labs for film anymore as digital is far more cost-effective and scales better.

    IMO film will exist, both colour and B&W, as an artisan product. My understanding of the economics of the motion picture industry is that film is a decade away from obsolescence as the sunk cost of emulsion and Digital ICE is still cost-effective and substantially high-quality.

    The real danger for film manufacturing is not the price of silver or petrochemicals, but whether SLR or RF cameras will continue to be designed and manufactured, including critical source components like Seiko shutters. The world can only coast along for a limited time with no new product to house 135 and 120 production runs. As much as I am annoyed by the hipsterism of lomography, they've wittingly stumbled on the economic conundrum facing analog photography. Without the economy-of-scale of 135 in particular, emulsion films are at risk.

  9. #59
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Rochester, NY
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    24,431
    Images
    65
    Aristophanes;

    There was a migration of used analog 35mm and MF cameras to Africa in the early 90s as the photo enthusiasts bought the less expensive used older generation cameras. This also took place in SA and thus Kodak built the plant in Brazil to "feed" the need for analog products in the southern hemisphere. Unfortunately, the model overlooked the fact that prices would drop rapidly on digital goods.

    Kodak's experience in China was that quite a few people there wanted color prints due to the lack of computers and so the photos were transmitted to a hub kiosk, optional CDs were burned, and prints were made. A lot of film was shot in China to be digitized and then sent all around the country to show extended family what was going on.

    PE

  10. #60
    cmacd123's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Stittsville, Ontario
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    1,292
    Globe and Mail reports a new high for silver again today ;(
    Charles MacDonald
    aa508@ncf.ca
    I still live just beyond the fringe in Stittsville

Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  Ś   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin