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  1. #11
    ZorkiKat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole
    Are you sure of that? Rapid Rectilinears tend to be f:7.2 at best, anything faster than f:7 would surely be called "Extra Rapid" in some variation. My bet would be a 2+2 Anastigmat instead of a RR. Anyway, it should be a very fine lens!
    Don't underestimate the triplets though - some of them are very good, and the best ones are exellent!

    The lens' layout does resemble a rapid-rectilinear. Two "doublets" on either side of the iris, laid out symmetrically. Having a 4,5 max aperture does cloud it up.

    I have fine regard for the triplets. I like them in my "cheap" TLRs. When I use older cameras, I'm never really concerned with lens quality. I could easily turn to the more modern ones if I wanted that. In fact, the main reason for me to use older cameras/optics is the charm that the older lenses have which I think have far more relevance than sharpness or contrast

    BTW, the Fotokor is the camera which my cat is shooting with in my avatar.

    Jay
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    "不管黑猫白猫能抓到老鼠就是好猫。" 邓小平
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  2. #12
    DBP
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    BTW, if anyone needs plate holders for the Voigtlander Avus 9x12 or any of its German cousins with the same back, the Fotokor holders fit, and are really cheap. I got mine from Alex-Photo on the auction site.

  3. #13
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    Contessa Nettel 9x12

    Thank you all for your help. I've gone and done it, bought a camera because I'm impatient. It's a Contessa Nettel 9x12 (1926 model). It didn't come with any plate holders, so I thought I'd ask if anyone knew just which brands of holders would work. Is it compatible with the Fotokor holders? Any others? Anyone have extras for sale? Yours, Matt

  4. #14
    Mike Kovacs's Avatar
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    Anyone know if those Fotokor holders also fit the Patent Etui 9x12 (aka Kawee)? I recall this camera has just a slightly shorter holder or some small difference.

    It just occured to me - the North American name "Kawee" is simply the German way of writing-out the sound of the letter K.W., "Kah-vay". I guess similar to Ihagee, german I H G pronouced "ee haw gay" for Industrie und Handelsgesellschaft.
    If it says Zeiss or Rollei, the answer is YES!
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  5. #15
    Ole
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    I don't know the Fotokor holders well enough to say what they fit.

    If anyone has a list of the dimensions of the holders for various plate cameras, it would be a very nice gesture to make it available here!

    I do know that Voigtlander holders almost fit the Kawee (that's German pronunciation of "KW", not American. The Germans call it KaWee too!). Almost, but not quite. The "lip" on the sides should be thinner for the KaWee.

    BTW, the only one of my plate cameras I dont have holders for is the 6.5x9cm KW Patent Etui. I'm still looking for some (I have the film inserts, though).
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
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  6. #16
    Mike Kovacs's Avatar
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    I understand the name "Kawee" was a name variation of the "Patent Etui" for North American markets (source, McKeown's 2006). I'm certain most English speakers would say "kaw wee" not "kaw vay".
    If it says Zeiss or Rollei, the answer is YES!
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  7. #17
    Ole
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    "KW" is the abbreviation for Kamera-Werkstatten, Dresden; the maker of the Patent Etui among other cameras. So the KaWee is a German "invention" from the pronunciation, just like the (IHG) Ihagee.
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

  8. #18
    Mike Kovacs's Avatar
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    We're preaching from the same pulpit Ole!

    ...and getting off topic (apologies). Plate cameras are a lot of fun to shoot with. Just try when you can to get all of the pieces together in one package when possible (ground glass back, plate holders, film sheaths etc).

    Otherwise you may be looking for esoteric odds and ends for your plate camera for a LONG time!
    If it says Zeiss or Rollei, the answer is YES!
    My Flickr Gallery

  9. #19
    Donald Qualls's Avatar
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    No, even the Contess-Nettal 645 holders that are similar in size do not fit the Patent Etui (been there, tried 'em). The side recesses for the slide rails don't go far enough up the sides toward the dark slide end, so the 645 holders won't seat in the Kawee/Patent Etui back. KW did make a couple other models of plate cameras prior to issuance of The Patent which, as far as I've been able to tell, used the same holders, and the company or their designs were apparently bought or licensed by Bentzin at some point -- there's a Bentzin Primar that's a perfect copy of the Patent Etui, and Bentzin made/sold at least one version of the Pilot 6x6 SLR as well.

    BTW, I tried Voigtlander holders -- they actually would slide into my Kawee (tolerances, or wear), but they were too long to match up the velvets, and the film wouldn't have been lined up behind the body opening. It might be possible to trim the edges of a Voigtlander holder, if you have a Kawee with enough tolerance to let it slide in, but you're on your own for light tightness afterward (maybe some JB Weld from the inside?)...

    Generally, if you find 9x12 plate holders with KW imprint on the back, they ought to fit the Etui -- otherwise, it's a matter of very careful measurement, and then they still sometimes don't fit because you missed measuring something important...
    Photography has always fascinated me -- as a child, simply for the magic of capturing an image onto glossy paper with a little box, but as an adult because of the unique juxtaposition of science and art -- the physics of optics, the mechanics of the camera, the chemistry of film and developer, alongside the art in seeing, composing, exposing, processing and printing.

  10. #20

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    Being the owner of a 1926 9x12 ZI-Trona, I have one of the "Standard" cameras, of which it has mentioned, there are many. ZI came out with plate holders and film holders for this camera that match most of the cameras in the ZI line. I don't use them.

    In the 40's and 50's, many aftermarket firms came out with adapters for standard Type 5 film holders. These are the 2 sided types used in press cameras, even to today. The adapters I have are equipped with ground glass and spring backs. Very nice and the good part is you don't have to remove your ground glass before every shot. The Type 5's use 3.25 x 4.25 film, readily available vie the internet (Thanks John), and the cameras are very small and easy to use. This is one of the cheapest ways to get your 9x12 up and running.

    tim in san jose

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