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  1. #11
    Ole
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    Kadlubek's (fifth ed.) says EUR 80 for a Maximar, and EUR 60 to 90 for an Avus. Bergheils double that and up...

    There will be variations with different lenses and shutters, different modelss with slightly different features and so on, but except for Bergheils with Heliar lens the price is remarkably constant.

    I'm deliberately not fiving the prices in US $, since the exchange rate has changed in the time since printing - and these cameras are more common in Europe thus the EUR price is more stable.
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

  2. #12
    Ole
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soeren View Post
    Well, now when its out in the open, how easy are the holders to achieve and are they plateholders with cutfilm adapters?
    Holders are quite easy to find, but it's always best to buy a camera WITH holders. Otherwise you are bound to find out just how many slightly incompatible systems there are...

    The holders are plate holders, which may have cut film adapters inside. Or they may not. Some I bought had unexposed plates in them.

    But at least the cut film adapters are standard: any 9x12cm sheath will fit in ant 9x12cm plate holder. They would have to, since they are all the same size as a 9x12cm glass plate.
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole View Post
    But at least the cut film adapters are standard: any 9x12cm sheath will fit in ant 9x12cm plate holder.
    ...with the happy exception of the Kodak combination holders, which (1) don't need a sheath at all, and (2) fit Voigtlaender cameras (and the various compatible ones) nicely. There seem to be a fair number of them around in both the 9x12 and 6.5x9 sizes, I suppose originally associated with Kodak's Recomar plate cameras.

    The Recomars, and the Nagel Fornidars that preceded them, are also very nice cameras, and a whole lot cheaper than a Bergheil. The lenses aren't on par with Heliars---they seem mostly to be Xenars relabelled as "Kodak Anastigmat", but Xenars are perfectly good lenses, and the cameras command no particular price premium, I suspect because a lot of people see "Anastigmat" and assume it means "triplet".

    -NT

  4. #14
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    From the few I've come across I was under the impression that the Formidar's & Recomar's either had Nagel-Doppel Anastigmat f/4.5 135mm, Nagel Laudar f4.5 135mm, and later Kodak Anastigmatic f4.5 135mm's and alternatively the top versions having Tessar or Xenar f4.5 135mm lenses.

    Ian

  5. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    From the few I've come across I was under the impression that the Formidar's & Recomar's either had Nagel-Doppel Anastigmat f/4.5 135mm, Nagel Laudar f4.5 135mm, and later Kodak Anastigmatic f4.5 135mm's and alternatively the top versions having Tessar or Xenar f4.5 135mm lenses.
    I've been trying to research these lenses a little bit, and as far as I can tell there's a lot of confusion, but it does seem to be pretty certain that Nagel-werk never made lenses---anything labelled "Nagel-Doppel Anastigmat" is a lens sourced from someone else and rebranded, as are many of the Kodak Anastigmats.

    The Vade Mecum doesn't have much light to shed, but thinks that at least some 105mm Nagel Anastigmats on 6x9 folders were triplets.

    -NT

  6. #16
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    NT, a lot of the 9x12 camera manufactures offered cheap lenses that they probably bought in branded for them. The cheapest lenses were triplets, the Nagel Ladar may be one, the Nagel-Doppel Anastigmat f/4.5 135mm was probably a just a run of the mill Anastigmatic.

    The only really decent 9x12 lenses are sold under the lens manufacturers own name, that does match the camera manufacturer in the case of Zeiss, and the Tessar, Voightlander and the Heliar, Goerz and the Dagor, Rodenstock and the Eurynar, there may be others.

    Ian

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ole View Post
    Holders are quite easy to find, but it's always best to buy a camera WITH holders. Otherwise you are bound to find out just how many slightly incompatible systems there are...

    I will hold out till the next camera fair at the end of this month. Changes are that I can buy a complete set with holders and all. I might pay a little bit more than the Ebay but at least I have a change to (dry)test it all before I buy it. For that I'm willing to pay a little more. And once I got some holders I know what to look for. I will see if they have a nice Maximar at a decent price there.
    Sure, I could give you a boring explanation who I really am but I rather let the Origami do the talking.

  8. #18
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Uncle Goose you edited your post as I was writing !!!!

    I only have plate holders, I need to make some more cut film inserts. My main problem is my 3 cameras & film are in the UK, and I live in Asia Minor (Turkey), unfortunately airline weight restrictions are so low I've not had room to bring them yet.

    So far I've never seen cut film adapters for sale anywhere, and I look on Ebay on at least a weekly basis, plate holders are always available but only buy when a lot are listed and ending around the same time. The first ones fetch high prices then you get the bargains, and usually there's no difference in quality.

    Ian
    Last edited by Ian Grant; 09-11-2008 at 03:01 PM. Click to view previous post history. Reason: add

  9. #19
    Ole
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    http://www.oldcameras.at/platten.htm

    That's where I got some of my inserts, and some holders, before I bought a boxful of them on German ebay.
    -- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
    Norway

  10. #20

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    Hi Ian,

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    NT, a lot of the 9x12 camera manufactures offered cheap lenses that they probably bought in branded for them. The cheapest lenses were triplets, the Nagel Ladar may be one, the Nagel-Doppel Anastigmat f/4.5 135mm was probably a just a run of the mill Anastigmatic.
    I dunno. The whole history of Nagel/Kodak AG is a bit strange and unclearly documented; it seems to be very widely thought that the "Kodak Anastigmat" lenses on the Duo Six-20 (which was also made in the Nagel factory) were rebadged Xenars (there's a lot of discussion of this possibility at <http://photo.net/classic-cameras-forum/00FVVo>).

    With the earlier Nagel-branded lenses, I don't think anyone has an authoritative history of what came from where.

    The only really decent 9x12 lenses are sold under the lens manufacturers own name (...)
    That seems like too strong a statement to me. You're not saying "no Xenars were ever rebranded", are you?

    At some point I'll try to take a really close look at the "Nagel" lens on my 9x12 Fornidar. My feeling is that it handles bright lights too well to be a triplet, but maybe it's just a really good one.

    -NT

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