Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 68,701   Posts: 1,482,641   Online: 710
      
Page 2 of 12 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 117
  1. #11
    blansky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Wine country in Northern California
    Posts
    5,029
    Many artists through history have used their talents for propaganda. The best artists of their time worked on Catholic propaganda, Greek propaganda, Roman Propaganda, Egyptian propaganda...

    I think we have to take their work as it presents itself.

    That said, she certainly did glorify the Aryan myth beautifully.

    To some, the pictures used during the FDR era were propaganda for communism/socialism which helped dig the US out of the depression. Fortunately/unfortunately the war did the real work.


    Michael
    I couldn't think of anything witty to say so I left this blank.

  2. #12
    Krasnaya Zvezda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by haris
    ...

    Just think would you reject job offered by your government. And would you think it that situation "My government is evil (if it is), I will reject offered job"
    ...
    Yes. Referring to current administration of U.S., I would decline, and probably not respectfully.

  3. #13
    billschwab's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Meeshagin
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    3,746
    Images
    50
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerald Koch
    Therefore, we should ignore a person's obvious talent because we have a problem with some of their beliefs.
    When it comes to the glorification of Hitler and his beliefs?

    [SIZE=4][COLOR=DarkRed]YES[/COLOR][/SIZE]

    B

  4. #14
    copake_ham's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    NYC or Copake or Tucson
    Shooter
    35mm
    Posts
    4,092
    Images
    56
    Quote Originally Posted by Helen B
    So, she used her talent to make some of the best Nazi propaganda ever made. She knowingly glorified Hitler and the Nazi ideal. An ideal which was repugnant in its time and which is repugnant now. Can we really forget all that and judge her photographs in isolation? I'd be interested to know how many of the people who are suggesting that we acknowledge her talent without reservation (if that is what they are suggesting) have seen "Triumph of the Will". Hitler deified.

    Best,
    Helen
    Well said, Helen.

    Someone who could make "Triumph of the Will" was more than just a "casual Nazi" trying to get government work!

    She glorified a man and an ideology that systematically slaughtered over six million people. She was fortunate enough to avoid the Nuremberg noose and lived long enough for subsequent generations to become unaware of her role in supporting and advancing a hideous death machine.

    And let it not be forgotten that Jesse Owens accomplishments in the 1936 Olympics were greeted with derision by Hitler and his cohorts. So to say his favorite photographer took the "definitive" portrait of Owens is an insult to Owens!

  5. #15

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,670
    Richard Wagner was a rabid antisemite and as some as his contempories remarked "not someone you you want to invite to dinner". However, does this negate his obvious musical genius.

    Thomas Edison used to tour around the US electrocuting dogs and puppies to "prove" that his DC power was safer than the AC power advocated by Westinghouse. Does he somehow lose his talent because people shouldn't like him?

    Should we demand that famous people have absolutely perfect characters? I think not.

  6. #16
    billschwab's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Meeshagin
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    3,746
    Images
    50
    Quote Originally Posted by Gerald Koch
    Richard Wagner was a rabid antisemite... does this negate his obvious musical genius.
    Not the kind of thing I put on to entertain friends. That's for certain.

    This thread is telling me a little more than I want to know.

    B.

  7. #17
    MattCarey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,303
    Images
    31
    Quote Originally Posted by blansky
    She was a great photographer and her work was outstanding.

    The fact that she worked for the state she grew up in and rose to the top of the heap is a mark of her greatness. Was she a Nazi. Of course. How else would she get the commissions. It was the dominant party of her state.

    It is unfortunate that he state turned out to be a what it did, but using her as a whipping boy for that state makes little sense.

    Many of the founding fathers of this country were slave owners, and we excuse that by saying they were "of their time".

    She was also "of her time" and place.


    Michael
    Unfortunately, we will never know who the excellent photographers (and other people) were who decided not to join the Nazi party.

    Careful with the word "we". I don't excuse the founding fathers for being slave owners. It is a shame (in the truest sense of the word).

    If you were a scientist, I would ask, "who is the greater human--Albert Einstien or Werner Heisenberg".

    One left Germany the other stayed. Both were excellent Physicists. One is the better person.

    Matt

  8. #18

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Northern Aquitaine
    Shooter
    35mm RF
    Posts
    4,913
    Quote Originally Posted by Helen B
    I'd be interested to know how many of the people who are suggesting that we acknowledge her talent without reservation (if that is what they are suggesting) have seen "Triumph of the Will". Hitler deified.
    "Without reservation," no. "Acknowledge her talent," yes. And I have indeed seen a good deal of her work -- probably at least as much as anyone of my age (mid/late 50s) both cinematic and still.

    I do not think I have seen any here in the former camp ("Without reservation"). Anyone who refuses to join the latter camp ("Acknowledge her talent") must surely have a strange definition of talent.

    Cheers,

    R.

  9. #19
    c6h6o3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Shooter
    Large Format
    Posts
    3,137
    Images
    6
    Quote Originally Posted by Helen B
    I'd be interested to know how many of the people who are suggesting that we acknowledge her talent without reservation (if that is what they are suggesting) have seen "Triumph of the Will". Hitler deified.
    Frankly, I don't see that much talent. I think she was perfectly suited to the task of glorifying Nazism. She was every bit as much of a photographer as Hitler was a painter, or Albert Speer was an architect. Like all Nazi attempts at art, her work will be relegated to the historical dustbin it so richly deserves.

  10. #20

    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Northern Aquitaine
    Shooter
    35mm RF
    Posts
    4,913
    Quote Originally Posted by MattCarey
    Both were excellent Physicists. One is the better person.
    True. And your point is...?

    Staying in Germany didn't detract from his physics. Your opinion -- my opinion, the world's opinion -- of his personality and politics doesn't change that. Any more than it changes Leni's talent.

    Cheers,

    R.

Page 2 of 12 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin