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  1. #101
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    They have donated George Eastman's notebooks to GEH as promised, and that covers the early years from founding of the company through 19xx (and I don't know the year). These books are currently on the restricted access list from what I have been told, but IDK for sure. I know that a historical documentation project is under way. That is about all I can say.

    PE

  2. #102

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    That is about all I can say.
    All you can say, or all that you know... ;^)
    Kirk

    For up from the ashes, up from the ashes, grow the roses of success!

  3. #103
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    IDK where any of this stands. I have not heard anything on the subject discussed for over a year. So, thats all I know. In fact, as you see, I'm not sure of the status of George Eastman's notebooks as I have never looked into seeing them at all, nor would they be of much use.

    PE

  4. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I have not heard anything on the subject discussed for over a year.
    Same here.

  5. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I revisited the documentary and it froze about 1/2 way through...

    The coating operation itself is moving at about 10 feet per minute or thereabouts, but that would never pass in production which generally used about 100 ft/min even in those older times.

    I am going to try and watch it again, as that is just where it froze on me.

    PE
    The first mixing scene, where the brownish-red powder is being mixed, is indeed done in a small, non-jacketed kettle, but later on the KBr and AgNO3 are mixed in a regulation size jacketed kettle.

    As far as coating speed, I think all we saw was the start of the process... Can the speed be ramped up after starting out slowly?

  6. #106
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    Ray;

    You are right, the second kettle is jacketed and appears normal but small for full production. That is an old pilot kettle.

    As for speed, yes, coating rate can ramp up, but I've never seen or heard of it being done except with slide and curtain coaters. The reason I reached the conclusion I did is due to the fact that only at the slow speeds shown, can the roll changovers at the front and end of the machine be made manually. At about 100+ feet / min, it becomes very hard to change rolls manually as shown and can be dangerous as well.

    You can see the takeup speed at the rear end of the machine, and that kind of shows the speed.

    Also, note the red emulsion at the start, but the neutral color at the end of the operation. Seems like something happened in between to me. Different film or a chemical reaction.

    I'm totally confused about this. It looks like a hodge podge of things that are meant to confuse more than help.

    Another note is the fact that Gelatin from Eastman Gelatin has been delivered for years as pellets not sheets. The use of sheets went out in the 50s or earlier and I only saw sheet gelatin once in an old bottle in the stockroom. All of ours was either the pellet form or already prepared as 12% or 22%.

    It also strikes me that the sensitometric curve shown during testing is more like that of a lith film than a camera negative film.

    PE

  7. #107

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    Quote Originally Posted by AgX View Post
    But the dutch narration definetely refers to the long sides/rebates and the film shows an arrow gliding along those sides.
    It is further statet that those bevelled sides press firmly against the flanges of the spool.
    OK, working backwards (and walking out on a limb) I think I might have found a plausable original /and or translation:

    The yellow backing paper protects the film. The tapered end wraps around the film pushing it tightly against the film spool to avoid accidental exposure.

    this might have been translated into Dutch in such a way that when translated into English comes out:

    The yellow backing paper protects the film and the sides have been beveled, thereby pushing the film against the film reel and avoiding accidental exposure.

    Just a guess but it is the only way that makes sense to me.

    Anyway it is up to you guys.

    Which do you want?

    1.
    The yellow backing paper protects the film, it's tapered end wrapping around the film pushing it tightly against the film spool to avoid accidental exposure.

    or

    2.
    The yellow backing paper protects the film and the sides have been beveled, thereby pushing the film against the film reel and avoiding accidental exposure.

  8. #108
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    Ray;

    You must have missed what I posted about this. The paper backing is just slightly oversized for the spool to form a light tight fit. If so, it bends upwards due to being oversize. It takes up more space. By beveling the edges, the paper may bend upwards but pressure and the thinner nature of the film will compress it to become even and light tight.

    At least that is my take.

    Unless it is beveled to cause paper cuts on the fingers of the guy checking it out by running said fingers along the freshly slit edges.

    PE

  9. #109

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    That is an old pilot kettle.

    note the red emulsion at the start, but the neutral color at the end of the operation. Seems like something happened in between to me. Different film or a chemical reaction.

    I'm totally confused about this. It looks like a hodge podge of things that are meant to confuse more than help.
    How many Liters do you suspect it is?
    I thought the jacketed one looked like it might hold a 1000.
    Do you place it at less than that?

    As far as the color goes, these were shot in white light... could that gray be a print out color? There is no telling how long it had been exposed to light... that section might have been shot a day or two later...
    What color is a finished Verichrome Pan emulsion? If the Lab tech was actually preparing for a weeks run of VP; would we get gray from that mixture of green and red (along the other dyes as you mention)? Is that the color of the VP emulsion on film as we would see if we opened up a box? (I think so, but it has been too long for me to remember!)

    In anycase, we must remember that their only goal was to tell the story of how film was made and not to document one film's manufacture from start to finish.

    So I am not too concerned about those details. I think Kodak was careful, but nothing more. It's just the way movies are made.
    Last edited by Ray Rogers; 02-09-2009 at 02:18 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  10. #110

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Ray;

    You must have missed what I posted about this. The paper backing is just slightly oversized for the spool to form a light tight fit. If so, it bends upwards due to being oversize. It takes up more space. By beveling the edges, the paper may bend upwards but pressure and the thinner nature of the film will compress it to become even and light tight.

    At least that is my take.

    Unless it is beveled to cause paper cuts on the fingers of the guy checking it out by running said fingers along the freshly slit edges.

    PE
    I saw it, but then I looked a a roll of film I had handy...
    are you suggesting that Kodak discontinued the policy at some time?
    The TMY I was looking at seems to be a "just fit" cut snug.

    I was thinking the film it self might be slightly narrower than the backing paper, that might make sense, but if you are saying the backing paper is slightly over-sized for the spool, all I can say is ??? !

    I did not understand your finger cut sentence.

    Did you mean to say, "to NOT cause paper cuts" ?



 

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