I support myself and my son entirely from sales of my work, much of it to businesses who license the work to illustrate advertisements, books, magazines, etc. I get paid every time, no exceptions. The stone cold fact is, I cannot tell my son that I got paid 'photo credit' because he needs to eat. Three times a day, every day, no exceptions, ever. Same with me.
Originally Posted by wildbill
As another person said, your reply to us was snarky. Many of us here are fulltime professional artists and many others are commercial photographers. Those of us who are have plenty of paid work and paid usages of our photos.
I encourage anyone who is asked for photos for something like this to demand fair payment. Even if you have a 'real job' that isn't connected to photography, you could certainly use the money to buy more gear or to do something nice for your family. The last book cover I did brought me enough money to pay my rent, utility bills, food, gas, and other expenses for a month. For one photo, a month's income. Think about that before you give someone like the OP, who does not respect your work enough to pay for it, a free picture.
I believe it is good practice to do "pro bono" work once in a while. I have been given more than one break in my career.
I make a point to donate a certain amount of prints for non profit organizations fund raisers, and give a percentage to charities from some print sales every year, even though things are tough. I see it a a defying action against bad situations and it helps people. Is it scary? Oh yes, especially lately, but it is good practice to let go of that fear.
Actually, my image wasn't approved by the panel, and it wasn't a big let down.
Originally Posted by benjiboy
I saw it more as a missed opportunity to help two friends.
Giving pics to a charity you support is a hell of a lot different than giving something to a business. These people asking for pics are a business. If they cannot afford to pay their bills (and yes paying writes and photographers is a normal part of doing business as a publisher), then they need to evaluate whether they have the ability to keep the business going. Businesses are, not, and I repeat, NOT charities. They need to do what all of us did when we started our businesses: Save money, get business loans, find investors to back you, etc. Asking working people to work for free so they can have a business is arrogant and repugnant. No one has a right to be in business; an undercapitalized business fails in a free market economy, as well it should.
Originally Posted by Domenico Foschi
Did you read the word "pro bono" somewhere" in my post?
That is normal practice too. I am the first to say that I am not a good business man, but I do believe that my talent is not exclusively for sale. If I can help, even in hard times, a business that I think is important and is in bad water. Why not?
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Domenico, what you are talking about is supporting a charity through your work...this is admirable and just. I do it myself regularly.
A business, however, is not a charity. That is all that Chris is suggesting, and I think it's fair.
"Never criticize someone until you've walked a mile in their shoes. That way, you're a mile away and you've got their shoes."
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i'm with you domenico ...
i wish i had something suitable to submit.
the folks that put out the igNobel awards every year
used to get a bunch of us to work with them
for a bi-line and copies of the publication ..
i don't see anything wrong with helping out friends ...
I don't totally disagree with Chris, but I also think that there are lots of entities out there that benefit the community without being charities.
Originally Posted by chriscrawfordphoto
Publishing is done for profit, and it is done for the love of the material being published, and it is done for a mixture of the two. From my point of view, if a publication clearly is at least part a "labour of love" then I would be willing to consider making contributions to it without hope of financial rewards. I would expect, however, that:
1) it would be clear that there were others, including the principals of the operation, who were making similar contributions; and
2) the decision to make such a contribution is one to be made by me, voluntarily and in advance - people who don't pay bills they have previously agreed to pay do not attract any sympathy from me.
“Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”
Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2
I'm not sure how photographers are so different from writers but not one writer out of the hundreds who have submitted for their previous publications has been paid, asked for compensation, or complained in any way. If/ when in the future the press makes a profit and can pay the cover artist, I don't think I'll mention it here.
Do those of you who do not pay to subscibe to this forum feel that Sean (apug owner/operator) doesn't need to be comensated for his time/efforts? He can work for free but you wouldn't dream of it?
In case you missed it:
Originally Posted by wildbill
Last edited by wildbill; 12-16-2010 at 09:13 AM. Click to view previous post history.
I know what I want but I just don't know how to go about gettin' it.-Hendrix
Somehow this doesn't surprise me. When I was editing a little literary magazine, I'd get 20-30 manuscripts a day in my mail box. There was very little money or fame in it for anyone (in fact, it cost me a lot to keep it going, which is why I don't do it any more) but there are a lot of people out there who want to be published, no matter what. I'm quite familiar with the economics and social dynamics of small-press publishing. But I still think that publication just for credit is one step from vanity publishing.
Originally Posted by wildbill