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Thread: D76

  1. #11
    Bill Burk's Avatar
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    Referring again to the diagram of film curves, your earlier work was on the red line. Now you are at the blue line. You exposed minimally (maybe used 400 speed setting). I notice it in your subject's hair on the dark side away from the window. There is slight hint of detail for some hair can be seen. This is ideal by many standards of excellence.

    But the negative doesn't have much more to reveal. You could look at the negative and see that part of the negative is probably really clear. So increasing exposure the next time you take a picture will take you from the blue line to the green line. Then if you wanted to show more detail in the shadow, it would be on the negative.


  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pioneer View Post
    Personally I love working with medium format and large format film but lately I am primarily using 35mm. I have worked a lot with color but over the past year and a half I have been trying to teach myself black and white photography. I would love to say it is going well, but that wouldn't be completely true. That is one of the reasons I am using 35mm since it allows me to shoot film a little more economically. Knowing something technically does not equal artistic competence. I am a very slow learner so it has taken longer than I anticipated. Fortunately my grandchildren are still relatively willing subjects, and I live in an area with amazing mountains and desert panoramas.

    I am semi-retired but professionally I do freelance forensic photography for a number of rural police departments, and the occasional attorney, who do not have adequate budgets to support one of their own. It is a pretty restricting discipline and "artistic license" is not really appreciated, but I do enjoy doing it. However, it is all done digitally, and though I do appreciate what digital is capable of, I much prefer film in my personal life.

    How about yourself? From the posts I have seen you seem interested in large format photography. What is it like photographing in your country?
    Hi,

    I am a consultant by profession mostly dealing in IT related projects. Started using the camera some 9 years ago when we had our first daughter. First camera was a sony cyber shot, and ever since then interest kept increasing and here I am now. I was always interested by the look of a bigger sensor results and film is even better. I don't have the best gear, a modified Polaroid as a 4x5 camera no movements or lenses. But it keeps me going, I am planning on upgrading to a real view camera and have been contemplating on whether to get a 4x5 or go straight for the 8x10.

    Photographing in Pakistan can be very exciting as there are a lot of different cultures, history if one is willing to find. But the challenging part is that film is completely dead and you don't get anything. I get all my stuff from abroad friends have been very kind and they bring whatever I need from their trips abroad. We don't get film not even 35mm I mean black and white, no chemicals etc. etc. I have been trying to find a 4x5 enlarger for the last two years ever since I started LF but still have not been able to. That is one of the reason I want to shoot 8x10 because then I will contact print and will try to take the enlarger out of the equation for the time being at least.

    I am looking for a favourable deal for a 8x10 until then will continue shooting 4x5

    Cheers

    Raffay


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  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Burk View Post
    Referring again to the diagram of film curves, your earlier work was on the red line. Now you are at the blue line. You exposed minimally (maybe used 400 speed setting). I notice it in your subject's hair on the dark side away from the window. There is slight hint of detail for some hair can be seen. This is ideal by many standards of excellence.

    But the negative doesn't have much more to reveal. You could look at the negative and see that part of the negative is probably really clear. So increasing exposure the next time you take a picture will take you from the blue line to the green line. Then if you wanted to show more detail in the shadow, it would be on the negative.

    Hi Bill,

    I am completely lost with these curves, I am sure it is my bad that I am not being able to grasp a simple concept. I have read your earlier post explaining the concept using a mountain trail example but still it is not clear to me how to interpret it. Forgetting the curves for the moment if I try to understand it as a basic concept then I should have metered the left side hair and if I think that the shadows are a zone three and if I want to show some details then I should open the aperture or decrease the shutter speed by one whole stop to bring it to zone IV that will show details on the hair that are away from the window. I am not sure of the exact readings but that might blow the side of the face facing the window. Then when I try to adjust in PS it comes back to the same situation where shadows are dark and the blown highlights don't look blown but has no good feel or details. I am quite sure I am missing some basic point in exposure area, and I really hope that I understand quickly what you are trying to teach me.

    Cheers

    Raffay


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  4. #14
    Bill Burk's Avatar
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    Highlights don't get blown out on black and white negative film like they did back in the days of Ansel Adams and the Zone System.

    If you take two pictures, normally expose one (blue line) and overepose the other (green line). Develop them both exactly the same as the portrait you started this thread with. Then print (scan) them with the same settings only "change the brightness" to match - without changing the contrast... Then the pictures will be identical... Except the overexposed negative will have detail in the shadows that you can do something with.

    p.s. On the graph, 15 divisions is one f/stop.

  5. #15
    Pioneer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raffay View Post
    Hi,

    I am a consultant by profession mostly dealing in IT related projects. Started using the camera some 9 years ago when we had our first daughter. First camera was a sony cyber shot, and ever since then interest kept increasing and here I am now. I was always interested by the look of a bigger sensor results and film is even better. I don't have the best gear, a modified Polaroid as a 4x5 camera no movements or lenses. But it keeps me going, I am planning on upgrading to a real view camera and have been contemplating on whether to get a 4x5 or go straight for the 8x10.

    Photographing in Pakistan can be very exciting as there are a lot of different cultures, history if one is willing to find. But the challenging part is that film is completely dead and you don't get anything. I get all my stuff from abroad friends have been very kind and they bring whatever I need from their trips abroad. We don't get film not even 35mm I mean black and white, no chemicals etc. etc. I have been trying to find a 4x5 enlarger for the last two years ever since I started LF but still have not been able to. That is one of the reason I want to shoot 8x10 because then I will contact print and will try to take the enlarger out of the equation for the time being at least.

    I am looking for a favourable deal for a 8x10 until then will continue shooting 4x5

    Cheers

    Raffay


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Before retirement I worked as an auditor/investigator for a large mining company that had an exploration project in your country somewhere near the border with Iran. Never made it there myself but several friends have been there and found it very interesting.

    I started large format with 8x10 for your exact same reason, I could contact print and get a decent sized photo. I finally picked up an enlarger so most of my LF work is now done with a Graflex 4x5. Not very many movements but it fits my needs almost perfectly.

    Good luck with your learning. I develop almost exclusively with D-76, though I occasionally use some HC-110 or Rodinal as well.

    I find Bill's suggestions very good. With the newer black & white films I almost always put the shadows where I want detail at Zone IV anymore. It gives me great detail in the shadows and I can hold the highlights in developing.

    Have fun. I too am still learning and I love it.

  6. #16
    RalphLambrecht's Avatar
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    Yes, much improved!
    Regards

    Ralph W. Lambrecht
    www.darkroomagic.comrorrlambrec@ymail.com[/URL]
    www.waybeyondmonochrome.com

  7. #17
    Bill Burk's Avatar
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    I should echo what Ralph just wrote, Raffay...

    This image is one to be proud of, and no further improvement is really needed. By many measures it is perfect.

    The only reason I suggested any further improvement is because you are already going in the right direction.

  8. #18

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    Thank you all, it feels good reading all the encouraging comments. @Bill: I would still want to completely understand what you tried to teach me through those curves - to be honest I am still quite lost on those I would read the whole thing again and will then ask some questions, hope you don't mind.


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  9. #19

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    Here is a picture taken of the same area today minus the subject. It was taken with my mobile so I think HDR was on therefore most of it is quite balanced. In real the cabinet is quite in the shadow. I am posting this picture to learn how to meter. I have taken values with my light meter and following are the light meter readings corresponding to different areas:

    1. Scene outside the window - 5.6
    2. Window frame - 2.8
    3. I placed my hand where my wife's face was and the reading is - 1.4
    4. Brown cabinet - 1.0



    Now, please guide me how should one approach this scene. In a short time when most of the subjects are telling you to hurry up, one tends to get more confused and when you take into account the shutter sped and aperture then all numbers start to just bounce in your head and all the planning is gone and most of the times you don't know why you shot at the settings you did

    Cheers

    Raffay


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  10. #20
    Bill Burk's Avatar
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    I think you need a different shutter speed. I get the pressure too (I shoot a modified instant camera as well)

    If you need a benchmark reading, take a reading on your hand - and then "open up" one stop (so 1.0 is the final answer). If your meter has an incident mode - that's the same thing.

    I always do that as a "tentative" reading and then take other meter readings to see how the different parts of the scene might turn out.

    So in one reading you can take a picture. Then you can relax after taking the picture and think about the different readings. As you get better at this, you might take the meter readings before your family arrives and then make up your mind in advance.

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