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  1. #1
    masimix's Avatar
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    Solarization with Ilford paper and developer?

    Is it possible?

    I'm teaching phototechnique in an art school, and there is a project on surrealism coming up. Solarization is one of the topics we are going through. I remember doing solarizations when I was a student myself, but can't remember much more than turning on the lights at some point when the paper was in the developer.

    I have been reading a little bit here (http://www.apug.org/forums/forum41/5...n-man-ray.html) and there (http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/So...arization.html), and found out (among several things) that solarization of large-format negatives (by exposing them to light during developing) can be one thing. Anyway, I would like to show them solarization of prints, but it seems like developer/paper combo is important.

    Can Ilford RC-paper and Ilford MG-developer be used succesfully? (It's what we use at the school now). We have EFKE 25 ISO 4x5" film, so maybe that is a good one to try for film?

    Any tip and experiences you have would be great, thanks!

    Marius

  2. #2
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    Marius;

    What you describe is the Sabattier effect. You flash a light on the print in the developer. This is usually done at about 3/4ths of the way through development and is about 1 - 5 seconds with a white light at about 10W at 5 feet. I use that strange measure because I just take the filter off my safelight and flash the paper.

    It generally gives poorer results with MG papers due to the color of the light source which can alter contrast. It is more stable with graded paper.

    PE

  3. #3
    cliveh's Avatar
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    Photo Engineer is quite correct, do not confuse Solarization with Sabattier.

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

    Francis Bacon

  4. #4
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    +1 to what PE said. I've also had cool results by aiming a small LED flashlight around the edges of the print while it's in the tray and once it's been in the developer about half the total time. It gives the effect around the outside and sorta affects the middle of the photo, but to a lesser effect. You do have to kinda play with it.

  5. #5
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    It is basically a negative superimposed on a positive. And you should see it in color! Wow. I've posted a few of them here in my gallery. I've done some digitally as well but did not post them here. I used a hybrid work flow from Portra negatives and printed on color paper and also digitally.

    PE

  6. #6
    masimix's Avatar
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    I'm no longer confused, it's the Sabatier Effect! Solarization is "The exposure necessary to produce true solarization is in the range of 1,000 to 10,000 times that necessary to produce total black in the negative" (From unblingkingeye.com). What I'm talking about is Pseudo-Solarization.

    Thank you PE for thee tip on graded paper, I had a try today in the darkroom, and used some old paper that I had, Ilfospeed Grade 4. I also tried Ilford MG, but the Ilfospeed worked a lot better, it produced good results, the MG just turned out more or less as an over-pre-flashed paper.

    Anyone tried with film? Im thinking large format in trays might work, but of course, that takes more time.

    Marius

  7. #7
    cliveh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masimix View Post
    I'm no longer confused, it's the Sabatier Effect! Solarization is "The exposure necessary to produce true solarization is in the range of 1,000 to 10,000 times that necessary to produce total black in the negative" (From unblingkingeye.com). What I'm talking about is Pseudo-Solarization.

    Thank you PE for thee tip on graded paper, I had a try today in the darkroom, and used some old paper that I had, Ilfospeed Grade 4. I also tried Ilford MG, but the Ilfospeed worked a lot better, it produced good results, the MG just turned out more or less as an over-pre-flashed paper.

    Anyone tried with film? Im thinking large format in trays might work, but of course, that takes more time.

    Marius
    Yes, I or rather my students have experimented with this. As yet I have not been able to replicate the effects produced by Man Ray, but am working on it. To date we have achieved some quite interesting effects using flash late in the development cycle. Photo Engineer can probably provide better info on this, but my intuition tells me that high a energy short illumination will give a better effect (more Makie lines) than a longer exposure to lower illumination?

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

    Francis Bacon

  8. #8
    masimix's Avatar
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    I would like to try with film, how did your (or the students) tests turn out cliveh?

  9. #9

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    Edward Weston solarized a few of his nudes.
    5x7 Eastman-Kodak kit / B+M 135mm Zeiss Tessar + Compur Deckel
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  10. #10
    cliveh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masimix View Post
    I would like to try with film, how did your (or the students) tests turn out cliveh?
    We were doing it with 35mm film cut into 3 strips at random and developed in seperate tanks. The development time was 12.5 minutes at 20C. The first tank we took the spiral out after 8 minutes and let off a small flash at about 4 feet away, the second after 10 minutes and the third after 11. It looked like 8 and 10 were good, with nice Mackie lines. However, it would be nice to learn from others about how to replecate the techniques of Man Ray. By the way the original shots were high key taken in a studio.

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

    Francis Bacon

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