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Thread: Pushing Pyro

  1. #11

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    I found that PMK is pretty much pooped out after 16-18 minutes when tray processing Tri-X 8x10. It was difficult to get past an N+1 negative. The advice to have a second, fresh bath is good.

    Peter Gomena

  2. #12

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    Worth trying PMK+ if you've got any Amidol. Hutchings suggested you could gain up to 1/2 stop speed by adding a pinch of Amidol to the working solution right before use.

  3. #13
    RPippin's Avatar
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    Thanks Michael, a pinch it will be.

  4. #14
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    How did it go?
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  5. #15
    RPippin's Avatar
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    Sorry Thomas for the lack of follow up on this. I'm going to try pushing some Foma 400 as soon as it comes in from Freestyle. I'm going to start with 4X5 and add .1g of Amidol to my PMK and do some tray developing. It's the only way I can justify mixing a whole liter, as the BTZS tubes use less than 500 ml for 6 sheets. Not to good at tray developing, but I'll try not to scratch up the negatives. Will scan and post as soon as I get some results.

  6. #16
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RPippin View Post
    Sorry Thomas for the lack of follow up on this. I'm going to try pushing some Foma 400 as soon as it comes in from Freestyle. I'm going to start with 4X5 and add .1g of Amidol to my PMK and do some tray developing. It's the only way I can justify mixing a whole liter, as the BTZS tubes use less than 500 ml for 6 sheets. Not to good at tray developing, but I'll try not to scratch up the negatives. Will scan and post as soon as I get some results.
    I'm really curious to what you find. The highest speed I've been able to get with Fomapan 400 is 320 using Xtol 1+1. But at 800 some really cool shots can still be had, especially in scenes where shadow detail is not the 'end all' criteria for success.
    For more shadow speed I recommend using an older and lower contrast lens, which tend to open up the shadows significantly. Might gain you as much as a half to a full stop of speed.

    I actually have some Foma 400 in 5x7 at home. I might take the 5x7 for a spin, and I'll try push processing at EI 800 using DD-X or Xtol 1+1. Be interesting to compare.
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  7. #17

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    Although I haven't personally tested the PMK+Amidol formula, I'm still pretty sure you'll have an easier time pushing with XTOL or DDX. Between XTOL 1+1 and DDX, although I haven't tested them for pushing, since XTOL 1+1 produces more of a shoulder than DDX with normal development, I would expect it to have the edge over DDX with overdevelopment when it comes to taming contrast. With normal development I've found DDX and XTOL to produce very similar speed, DDX being very slightly faster (probably trivial for practical purposes), although XTOL appears to have the edge when it comes to shadow contrast.

    I've never tried Foma films though, so take this for what it's worth.
    Last edited by Michael R 1974; 07-18-2012 at 03:58 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  8. #18
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    I have been over developing my sheet film to get a more contrasty negative. The results I believe would allow for pushing from 400 to 800 ASA.

    I am not sure if this relates exactly, but let me throw it out there, either to try and help or perhaps show my ignorance. I shoot HP5 and T-Max 400 in 8x10 and 7x17, developing in Rollo Pyro from B&S in a Jobo CPP-2 at 68 degrees for 6 min 15 seconds. I expose 1 stop over what the meter and bellows factor say. I take a second shot with two stops longer time than the first exposure. I believe a very good negative almost always comes out of this effort unless I have made a large blunder.

    I do this thinking that you can get a very good print one stop either side of the correct exposure. This gives me a six stop range of very good prints or some very interesting printing options. Considering the other costs involved in shooting LF and ULF, I feel this is worthwhile.

    This Fall I will be taking a Van Dyke printing class for a full college term. I will need a lot of very contrasty negatives for the term. Most of the students will be making theirs digitally. For the last two months I have been developing @ 130% of the time. Both exposures are more contrasty. My lighter exposure is denser and would I think be the same as doubling the film speed. My longer exposure is also more contrasty and still very printable.

    I hope this either gives you the help you are looking for or opens some interesting conversation.

    John Powers
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

  9. #19
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    John,

    I would have no problems shooting TMax 400 @ 800 and get results that are very acceptable, even from a highly technical standpoint. Foma 400 is completely different in terms of film speed, and my experience thus far with four different developers is that its true speed is somewhere between EI 200 and 250.

    The best success I've ever had with it was in 35mm using Edwal 12 developer. Believe it or not, I used the film at EI 160, almost one and a half stop below box speed, and while the resulting prints are something that I'm very happy with I still feel like I'm not getting full shadow detail.

    Example attached. Slightly cropped 35mm neg, printed on Fomabrom 112 in Ethol LPD, toned in Kodak Sepia II and Rapid Selenium toner.

    I guess I'm showing this because the Foma 400 film just isn't a film that I've been able to get 400 out of, under any circumstance.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Door at Bay 20.jpg  
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  10. #20
    jp80874's Avatar
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    I have no experience with Foma 400, only T Max 400 and HP5 in Rollo Pyro. My results suggesting pushing with Rollo Pyro were really incidental to my efforts to add contrast to the two size and brand negatives that I am using. I should add that the 7x17 T Max I have been using was bought over the last two years when other people closed out their freezers of new old stock. With proper storage T Max at $4 a sheet is preferable to me over HP5 @ $9 a sheet. Fortunately a second marriage 20 years ago provided us with two 20 cu ft. freezers. I can’t imagine storing ten sheet T Max 16x20 boxes without a second freezer even if I had consolidated into Ilford boxes.

    John P.
    "If you want to be famous, you must do something more badly than anybody in the entire world." Miroslav Tichı

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