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  1. #21
    Sirius Glass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyn Arnold View Post
    I was a newbie (questionable if well-intentioned) to pick up on the replenished X-tol mystique.

    I'm so glad I did!

    Lyn
    I suggest that you shoot and develop five rolls without replenishment.
    Then replenish the developer for the five rolls.
    Next shoot ten rolls and develop with replenishment.
    Compare the rolls and decide for yourself.

    I like the improve tonality resulting in smoother ranges of tonality while retaining the definition, contrast, and edge sharpness. YMMV.

    Steve
    Warning!! Handling a Hasselblad can be harmful to your financial well being!

    Nothing beats a great piece of glass!

    I leave the digital work for the urologists and proctologists.

  2. #22
    Leigh B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirius Glass View Post
    Basically you do not understand replenishment nor the purpose of replenishment.
    Thank you, Steve. I do understand replenishment.

    In fact I use it with Diafine.

    With that developer the results are absolutely consistent for roll #1 or #100,
    regardless of whether the developer is freshly-mixed or two years old.

    That's what I expect from any reasonable developer choice.

    - Leigh
    “Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something.” - Plato

  3. #23
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh B View Post
    Thank you, Steve. I do understand replenishment.

    In fact I use it with Diafine.

    With that developer the results are absolutely consistent for roll #1 or #100,
    regardless of whether the developer is freshly-mixed or two years old.

    That's what I expect from any reasonable developer choice.

    - Leigh
    And I have had exactly the same results with replenished Xtol, using the same batch since 2008, simply replenishing 80ml every roll I run through. That about 1,000 rolls.
    I didn't even have to sacrifice the first ten. I just exposed some expired film to daylight and ran it through.
    See, replenished systems are incredibly stable, if you treat them right.
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  4. #24
    Leigh B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bertilsson View Post
    using the same batch since 2008, simply replenishing 80ml every roll I run through. That about 1,000 rolls.
    I said previously that replenished systems work fine when there's a reasonably constant work flow, about 5 rolls/week in your case.

    That's not true of the OP, who let the developer sit unused for 5 months.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Bertilsson View Post
    I didn't even have to sacrifice the first ten. I just exposed some expired film to daylight and ran it through.
    I guess you take solace in having discarded _only_ ten rolls of film. I've never discarded any.

    - Leigh
    “Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something.” - Plato

  5. #25
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    If you perceive a benefit and want to start it up, just buy a bulk roll of the cheapest, expired if possible, black and white film you can find, expose it and run it through. I suppose it shouldn't be totally exposed as in to daylight as that would probably be different from a roll of average exposures, but just put the rolls in a camera with a winder, point at a normal scene and hold the button down. Freestyle has their rebranded Foma for $33.99. Ten rolls is just over half the roll. (You can almost certainly find some expired cheaper.) That's about 20 bucks. That plus a five liter package of Xtol is less expensive than a gallon of Diafine (or a quart anywhere I found it - it's almost as much as the gallons, when you can find quarts.)

    Might be a little wasteful but if I wanted to try this I'd do something like that. It's not absurd, but does add a bit of cost to the start up.

    A quick look on ebay turned up four 36x rolls of expired TMX for $4.20. Buck a roll - find 10 rolls and use that. Cheap enough.

  6. #26
    Terry Christian's Avatar
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    I'm currently in the process of discontinuing my XTOL replenishment regime, simply because like the OP I was inconsistent in my shooting (much less in winter and the heat of summer). However, I got great results with it, and I doubt that the average home user without a densitometer would even discern a difference in the first few rolls compared to later "seasoned" rolls if it wasn't pointed out to him. After a long winter hiatus, I shot and developed some rolls in the spring with my same replenished XTOL without having dumped/replenished any -- much less the 25% recommended above! -- and everything was still working peachy. I had stored my XTOL properly, in a series of glass Absolut vodka bottles a friend had given me for the purpose (and no, I'm not a vodka drinker!).

    So, while I'm no expert on the subject, my experience with XTOL bears out what Thomas, Sirius, etc., have said above regarding its consistency and keeping properties.

  7. #27
    drumlin's Avatar
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    Add another to the list of Amateurs who's glad there's advice on starting a replenish system with xtol. Mines working great a year into it. Props to Thomas, Sirius , et al who've shared knowledge.

  8. #28
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh B View Post
    I said previously that replenished systems work fine when there's a reasonably constant work flow, about 5 rolls/week in your case.

    That's not true of the OP, who let the developer sit unused for 5 months.


    I guess you take solace in having discarded _only_ ten rolls of film. I've never discarded any.

    - Leigh
    There have been periods of over five months where I haven't used it. Replenish 80-100ml every two weeks, and it's fine. I used it again after several months, and it was perfect.

    Look, replenished systems work fine, even if you don't process regularly. Why are you fighting this so hard? Replenished Xtol is stable, reliable, and wonderful for your prints. The closest you'll get tonality wise is mixing it 1+3, but you won't get the fine grain of replenished. It'll be similarly sharp, and you'll gain half a stop of speed.
    It's about choices and what you value. Replenished Xtol gives me the ability to print using 35mm TMY-2 and TMX at 16x20 so that some experienced photographers and printers believe it's medium format. I find that tremendously satisfying, and while I like the developer for many reasons, it's the only developer besides Edwal 12 (also replenished) that I've been able to do this with. Ultimately my prints are for me, so it's not really that important what others think. But it is fun to throw somebody for a loop sometimes.
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  9. #29
    Jim Noel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave in Kansas View Post
    Last November, I mixed up a new batch of Xtol and developed a number of rolls through the winter months using the replenishing option, and was very satisfied with the results. For some reason, my film shooting and developing came to a near halt during the spring months when I shot only a few rolls of Pan F that I developed in Rodinal. So my replenished Xtol has been sitting untouched since mid-February.

    My Xtol stock solution and 1/2 gal. jug of working (replenished) solution are now well out of date and I need to mix a new batch of stock solution. I would like to continue using my 1/2 gal. Xtol replenished solution, but don't know how much of that should first be discarded and and refilled with newly mixed stock solution to start the replenished process going again.

    Any suggestions?

    Dave
    Yes, thow it away and start over. Developer is too cheap to waste time, film and energy trying to recover this obviously oxidized solution.
    [FONT=Comic Sans MS]Films NOT Dead - Just getting fixed![/FONT]

  10. #30

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    I've gone more than 6 months without a single roll thru my 1 gallon replenished Xtol. Poured out 400 ml, added Xtol mixed from 6 months, processed 4 rolls just to check, looked great as always, and then processed 40+ rolls. Absolutely consistent.
    I'd actually think it'd be a waste to trash the Xtol you have, without at least trying to bring it up. Replenished Xtol does have its own unique characteristics, just like Diafine or Rodinal does. Let Leigh B just be. He's obviously slanted against anything he's not a expert on, despite any evidence to the contrary. No sense arguing with him, he's set into his ways and we should all just let him be. If you''re interested in replenishing Xtol then do a bit of research on APUG and find out how to do it.

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