Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 70,224   Posts: 1,532,569   Online: 997
      
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 24
  1. #11

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,609
    Thanks for this. I'm going to go through it over the weekend in detail.

    I appreciate all the help and the postings you and Bill have been doing on flare, tone reproduction etc. I'm learning a lot about something I highly doubt most photographers are aware of.

  2. #12
    Stephen Benskin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    1,218
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R 1974 View Post
    I highly doubt most photographers are aware of.
    It's a shame there's not more interest in the subject. I think it's the key to making all the puzzle pieces fit.

  3. #13
    Stephen Benskin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    1,218
    Here is an example of the effect different levels of flare have on the negative log-H range and negative density range. It shows a no flare, a one stop, two stop, and three stop curve camera image situation. There is no change is film processing, camera exposure, or scene luminance range. The only variable is flare. Notice how it's the one stop flare curve where the shadow falls on 0.10 over Fb+f and not the no flare curve? The no flare shadow exposure actually falls one stop lower on the film curve.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Two Quad - Multi flare.jpg 
Views:	7 
Size:	464.0 KB 
ID:	54927
    Last edited by Stephen Benskin; 08-05-2012 at 03:27 PM. Click to view previous post history.

  4. #14
    Stephen Benskin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    1,218
    Michael, you seem to have had a change in your opinion on the importance of flare. What is your perspective and why do you think there's a lack of interest in the subject?

  5. #15

    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Montreal, Canada
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    4,609
    Stephen - sorry for the delay - will write more on this in the coming days.

  6. #16
    andrew.roos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Durban, South Africa
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    397
    Images
    12
    The amount of flare does not depend on the intensity of the light, but on the contrast range - not only of the scene being photographed, but potentially of everything that can cause light to fall on the front lens element. Flare is normally apparent in high intensity light simply because this enables a much wider contrast range - for example, direct sunlight falling on the lens (but outside the image area) gives very high contrast compared with deep shadows in the image itself, which means that only a tiny proportion of the direct sunlight need to be "misdirected" onto the film in order to give visible flare. You would get the same amount of flare if photographing under moonlight with the moon in the place where the sun was and the exposure adjusted to keep the image shadows in the same zone because the relative contrast between the moon and the shadows would be the same as the relative contrast between the sun and the shadows. (I'm discounting reciprocity failure here).

  7. #17
    Stephen Benskin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    1,218
    In addition to the luminance range's effect on the degree of flare is the luminance distribution. If flare was dependent on the luminance range alone, it would be predictable. Alas, it's not. Two scenes with the same luminance range can have vastly different flare factors depending on the ratio of lighter tones to darker tones. A white card with a small black square will have a higher flare factor than a black card with a small white square. In landscape photography, the amount of sky in the frame or just outside the frame usually has the largest influence on flare.

  8. #18
    Bill Burk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    3,193
    Images
    46
    And aimed into the sun, without a lens hood... The rays from the sun add flare on the surfaces of the lens elemnents (and filters)... And the rays can bounce off the side of the lens barrel or body of camera... adding more or less flare depending how well these surfaces are "painted" black.

  9. #19
    Stephen Benskin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    1,218
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Burk View Post
    And aimed into the sun, without a lens hood... The rays from the sun add flare on the surfaces of the lens elemnents (and filters)... And the rays can bounce off the side of the lens barrel or body of camera... adding more or less flare depending how well these surfaces are "painted" black.
    The type of flare from aiming the camera towards the sun tends to be more localized creating a ghost image of the diaphragm opening, as opposed to the evenly distributed veiling flare that is ubiquitous in any optical system.
    Last edited by Stephen Benskin; 08-18-2012 at 08:23 AM. Click to view previous post history.

  10. #20
    Bill Burk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Shooter
    4x5 Format
    Posts
    3,193
    Images
    46
    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen Benskin View Post
    The type of flare from aiming the camera towards the sun tends to be more localized creating a ghost image of the diaphragm opening, as opposed to the evenly distributed veiling flare that is ubiquitous in any optical system.
    The flare that I had in mind can be seen with the shutter open and back open and aim the camera so the sun is focused on the interior wall or bellows of the camera. Gears/levers in the camera can reflect... Black paint is rarely perfect... Even the tube of a telephoto lens can reflect. This can cause an evenly distributed, or at least widely spread, flare - and that is the kind you can resolve with a lens hood.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin