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  1. #11
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    Foma quality seems to be pretty good of late. And I've had nothing but great results from Adox papers (the newer ones coated in Germany, MCC 110 and MCP 312 in my case, not the older ones coated by Fotokemika which I have no experience with.)

    However, I have to agree about supporting Ilford. Great company, great products, they deserve our support.

  2. #12
    Photo Engineer's Avatar
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    I see a problem in definitions here.

    At EK, development, maintenance and improvement of products (as Simon notes above) was classed as Development at Kodak more than Research. If it was an existing product, process or machine, and the work was done outside of the Research labs, it was classed as Development work.

    Research and development were both conducted in the Research Labs however, and Development was also conducted in the Photographic Technology Labs which was later folded into KRL.

    PE

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    I see a problem in definitions here.

    At EK, development, maintenance and improvement of products (as Simon notes above) was classed as Development at Kodak more than Research...
    I am completely unconcerned with what it's called, as long as Ilford does whatever's necessary to continue producing its current product line. No improvements desired.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Santamaura View Post
    I am completely unconcerned with what it's called, as long as Ilford does whatever's necessary to continue producing its current product line. No improvements desired.
    I must disagree here. Improvement is desired. If a product is not being improved, it risks getting stale, and eventually eclipsed. On another thread several weeks ago, a lot of us begged Simon of Ilford to look into an IR820 infrared type of film. A product like that could take a lot of research in order to bring it to market affordably. I hope he is looking in to the possibility, because I would hate to see infrared film go by the wayside.
    While the products we currently have are very, very good, what about tomorrow, will we still be satisfied?

  5. #15
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    We'll be satisfied if it's all we have. Digital has already eclipsed 35mm film and full frame 35mm sensors can give MF a run for its money in terms of pure, objective quality. Most people shooting film are doing so for other reasons. Better films would be nice but realistically, keeping what we have is a lot more likely. There's always room for something like an infrared film which might not be all the new anyway, just from another company now that Efke is going away.

    While they're at it, it would be very nice if the pipe dream Ilford IR film were more like HIE than like IR820.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by madgardener View Post
    I must disagree here. Improvement is desired. If a product is not being improved, it risks getting stale, and eventually eclipsed...While the products we currently have are very, very good, what about tomorrow, will we still be satisfied?
    When Kodak is gone, Fuji abandons film and lower-tier manufacturers have followed Fotokemika into the history books, I will still be very, very satisfied with Ilford's current products. And those from Adox, which I expect to also be around.

    Let digital eclipse those stale, unimproved products for the masses. As long as today's offerings remain, all will be fine in the analog photography world.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Cole View Post
    Digital has already eclipsed 35mm film and full frame 35mm sensors can give MF a run for its money in terms of pure, objective quality.
    I totally disagree with that. My personal experience shows 135 film scanned with a 4000 ppi tabletop scanner to provide a quality which, as far as sheer resolution is concerned, is at least on par with a 20 megapixel camera (I say "at least" because the scanner gives 20 mp of real resolution both as luminance signal and as crominance signal, while a 20mp digital has 20mp luminance signal and a Bayer interpolation for crominance) and is otherwise WAY better than film as far as highlight rendition and dynamic range is concerned.

    Not everybody shooting film does it merely for "other reasons". People like me do it because it delivers better overall quality. There are "other reasons" as well, but quality is the first and foremost reason here.

    If this forum were more devoted to scanning technique (ahem, ... cough... cough.. ) forum participants would be more aware of the great quality which is delivered by the small format in hybrid use (which is de facto field where the comparison with digital capture would be measured).

    Digital wins hands down for speed and convenience. It still lags behind, in my opinion, as far as image quality is concerned, and that is 135 versus 135.
    Fabrizio Ruggeri fine art photography site: http://fabrizio-ruggeri.artistwebsites.com
    Stock images at Imagebroker: http://www.imagebroker.com/#/search/ib_fbr

  8. #18
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    Even if you do think the quality is better today (and I disagree when you're talking 35mm, at least at the upper end of digital) you won't tomorrow. Well maybe not tomorrow but next month or next year or whenever, and it won't be long.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Photo Engineer View Post
    Development was also conducted in the Photographic Technology Labs which was later folded into KRL.
    Sigh.... Photo Tech was a GREAT place to work!

  10. #20
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    Of course! Only second best to KRL!!!!

    Val tried to get me to move to PT, but I got Bill to move to KRL!

    PE

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