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  1. #41
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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  2. #42
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    I always appreciated that I could buy black and white paper chemicals and film in one millennium... and use them in the next... while maintaining the syntax of two millenniums ago...

  3. #43
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    "while maintaining the syntax of two millenniums ago..." Err, that would be the syntax of 0012, then - classical Latin?

  4. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by kuparikettu View Post
    The answer is simple. Color is so simple that it needs not be discussed. 'nuff said.

    Really, I don't shoot bw because it's too complicated and the colors aren't vivid enough for me. But the color process (RA-4 especially) is so simple that even someone doing it for the second time can handle it without any help. When doing RA-4 color prints I never worry about the temperature of the chemicals (Kodak chemicals work in room temperature), I process in trays and I have never done it in complete darkness -- dim yellow LEDs light the darkroom I use.

    Now then, there could be more discussions about more advanced color techniques (such as masking) but I guess people are either too pro to need to discuss them or too beginner to even know about them... which seems, to be honest, to be true about many things concerning darkroom color work, if judged by the amount of myths surrounding it being repeated even in this thread.
    Is this a joke?

    For color, in addition to density and contrast, you'll have to consider color balance. The darkroom practices are also harder: safelight is not safe with color, more stringent requirements on chemical temperature and the faster aging of color paper.

    For BW, everything is simpler and easier: safeligh; low requirements on temperature; tray processing and you can see the images; simpler processing (no bleach). You have complete control on the entire BW process.

    I think I somehow started the discussion in the wrong forum. Some of the folks here so biased toward the only thing they do...
    A photo amateur
    Sinar P2/F2/Nikon F100/Bronica ETRSi/GS/Saunders 4550XLG/Jobo CPP2/CPE+/Colorline 7000

  5. #45
    Poisson Du Jour's Avatar
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    Colour photography is a technical discipline. It requires the ability to see with the camera (not through it!), and the scene balanced visually and aesthetically to appeal, then enunciate it from the lens and the film's point of view (especially challenging with high contrast, vivid palette film like the Velvias). B&W is one-dimensional and interpreted by tone with many, many variations in darkroom-based practice. Many people will master and stick with B&W, others will master colour only (such as myself) and rarely dabble in another type of film. I once used only B&W but got bored, even with darkroom production, and needed the challenge of colour, without which I felt very unfulfilled.

    On the other hand, you can get an idea of the stuff the colour forum folk are rabbiting on about by paying a visit to the various undead Kodachrome threads. Seems nobody is going to allow it to rest in peace.
    “The photographer must determine how he wants the finished print to look before he exposes the negative.
    Before releasing the shutter, he must seek 'the flame of recognition,' a sense that the picture would reveal
    the greater mystery of things...more clearly than the eyes see."
    ~Edward Weston, 1922.

  6. #46
    Stephanie Brim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedSun View Post
    Is this a joke?

    For color, in addition to density and contrast, you'll have to consider color balance. The darkroom practices are also harder: safelight is not safe with color, more stringent requirements on chemical temperature and the faster aging of color paper.

    For BW, everything is simpler and easier: safeligh; low requirements on temperature; tray processing and you can see the images; simpler processing (no bleach). You have complete control on the entire BW process.

    I think I somehow started the discussion in the wrong forum. Some of the folks here so biased toward the only thing they do...
    One is not simpler than the other. Both have their challenges. Both are relatively simple to learn, but both require more time and knowledge to master. But they're also two very different processes. It's not really fair to compare one to the other.
    No idea what's going to happen next, but I'm hoping it involves being wrist deep in chemicals come the weekend.

  7. #47
    RPC
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedSun View Post
    Is this a joke?

    For color, in addition to density and contrast, you'll have to consider color balance. The darkroom practices are also harder: safelight is not safe with color, more stringent requirements on chemical temperature and the faster aging of color paper.

    For BW, everything is simpler and easier: safeligh; low requirements on temperature; tray processing and you can see the images; simpler processing (no bleach). You have complete control on the entire BW process.

    I think I somehow started the discussion in the wrong forum. Some of the folks here so biased toward the only thing they do...
    I see by your posts in other threads that you are new to color processing, so how can you judge it as truly harder? Many things seem hard when you first do them, but with experience they get easier as you work out the problems. I do both color and B&W and but I have done a lot more color and it seems easy now but with B&W I am still working out problems I have with it, but as time is going by I am solving the problems. Perhaps it is true that one is not simpler than the other but I think B&W with its larger number of variables is potentially more involving.

  8. #48
    Roger Cole's Avatar
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    I give up. He keeps repeating nonsense and is apparently immune to learning any different.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Cole View Post
    I give up. He keeps repeating nonsense and is apparently immune to learning any different.
    What you said is completely nonsense. You just like to argue, the same old.....
    A photo amateur
    Sinar P2/F2/Nikon F100/Bronica ETRSi/GS/Saunders 4550XLG/Jobo CPP2/CPE+/Colorline 7000

  10. #50
    ChristopherCoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Cole View Post
    I give up. He keeps repeating nonsense and is apparently immune to learning any different.
    troll, troll, troll.....


    I said it earlier.

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