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  1. #11

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    As you noted earlier the chemist/engineer guys like Mr. Koch or PE could probably provide an answer. Beyond the general logic behind this mixing practice I couldn't give specifics. I'll check Haist in the mixing practices section.

  2. #12
    Jim Jones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Carnie View Post
    I'd like to see some of your work Jim, not many people have gone down this route of creating images.
    This was shot on Tech Pan with a black background. The background reversed to a grey while the less dark shadows on the statue remained dark. The Mackie lines are black, not white.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails VenusS01a.jpg  

  3. #13
    luxikon's Avatar
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    I just mixed Dr. Jolly's developer and did not add hydroquinone. The negatives were 6x9 sheet film. With sandwich I meant contact printing.
    At the moment I can't continue the experimentation till I get some new Metol the next days.

  4. #14
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    Very nice Jim , great maki lines I like the way the black bleeds into the background.. Do you think this was due to the Tech Pan?
    QUOTE=Jim Jones;1450831]This was shot on Tech Pan with a black background. The background reversed to a grey while the less dark shadows on the statue remained dark. The Mackie lines are black, not white.[/QUOTE]

  5. #15
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    If you took this neg and did the paper method you would get a white maki as well which is very cool as well.

    QUOTE=Jim Jones;1450831]This was shot on Tech Pan with a black background. The background reversed to a grey while the less dark shadows on the statue remained dark. The Mackie lines are black, not white.[/QUOTE]

  6. #16
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Here are three more that I exposed in the last couple of weeks, These are not scans from real prints but interpertations, so they are not exactly
    how the main series is looking.

  7. #17

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    Just to round out the earlier mixing discussion for those interested, I went through Haist's chapter on mixing photographic solutions again. In the context of mixing order, while he does specifically mention that Metol will precipitate out if mixed into a Sulfite solution, he does not talk about adding a small amount of Sulfite to scavenge Oxygen before the Metol goes in. Both D-76 and D-72 are used as examples in the text (both containing Metol and Sulfite) and in neither case is any Sulfite added before the Metol.

    Of course, Haist is not the only credible source so who knows how the "pinch" practice came about. I'd have to defer to the chemists.

  8. #18
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    As far as now my experiment results in a complete reversal of image tones on my negatives, as well as beginning Mackie lines at EI 200. I exposed 6x9 sheet film Fomapan 100 (ASA 100) at EI 125, 160, and 200 with lower contrast at higher EI after development. But the negatives show remarkable fog. Normally the base and fog on this film has a density of 0.02 but these negatives have a b&f of 1.90 to 1.55, decreasing with increasing EI.
    I developed for 7 min in Dr. Jolly's developer with intermittend light (2 sec.) at 3,5 min.
    To get better results I intend to keep all variables constant and only change the intensity of the second exposure. Or would you suggest a better approach?

  9. #19
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    Dude - remarkable fog is what you are after..... to coin a phrase from my past commercial lab days... that negative looks flat as piss on a plate...

    If you do every thing right your negative will be flat and very non promising as a great neg to print from. Once you have the maki lines then you need to print with about a grade 4 paper. Being able to split the tones and create a image is your challenge and for what its worth , I spent 8 years making prints until I got the look I was dreaming of. I have hundreds of prints on the wrong paper with the wrong tone I can sell you ... cheap..

    It sounds to me that you are shooting live, which means going out with your camera and then processing later or next day.... If you are doing this then you will need to bracket your exposures as I do not think its possible to hit the sweat spot consistantly.. I am building a trailor to pull behind me when I travel to process on location,, much like my hero Bill Schwab and his wet plate trailor.
    As stated earlier in this thread , I shoot a series of negatives with a lighting setup in a makeshift studio, then immediately process and flash to see which fstop and shutter speed is correct for getting good maki lines, and even then I bracket two sheets of film, and I do not change my lighting for the duration of the shoot so I have some consistancy.

    I think 7 min development is too long btw , I use 5 min and flash half way.

    Don't give up , it may take you 8 years but it would be worth the journey down the worm hole.

    before you blast through all types of film I suggest one thing..

    practice on paper set at grade 4 until you can get a white maki line every time within two tests.
    Use only one film, they are all good in my opinion and FP4 works very well.
    Follow Jollys formula to the letter,,, until you are so shit hot good you feel compelled to make your own variation.

    also have fun or give up as it is very ass backwards process and can confuse the best of us.

    Bob


    Quote Originally Posted by luxikon View Post
    As far as now my experiment results in a complete reversal of image tones on my negatives, as well as beginning Mackie lines at EI 200. I exposed 6x9 sheet film Fomapan 100 (ASA 100) at EI 125, 160, and 200 with lower contrast at higher EI after development. But the negatives show remarkable fog. Normally the base and fog on this film has a density of 0.02 but these negatives have a b&f of 1.90 to 1.55, decreasing with increasing EI.
    I developed for 7 min in Dr. Jolly's developer with intermittend light (2 sec.) at 3,5 min.
    To get better results I intend to keep all variables constant and only change the intensity of the second exposure. Or would you suggest a better approach?

  10. #20
    luxikon's Avatar
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    Hi,

    to get unvariable conditions I created a table top arrangement with constant light situation. I took the pictures of an object with increasing underexposure and developed immediately in my darkroom and printed with extreme gradation.

    This is such an amazing process that I can imagine it will fazinate me for a long time too. It's like starting darkroom work anew.

    Your information about fog and flatness is very helpful.

    Klaus

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