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Thread: Blue Tone Blues

  1. #11
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Toning using colour couplers requires a normal rehalogenating bleach - ferricyanide and bromide, then after washing redevelopment in a colour developer with the relevant coupler added, for blue it's αlpha-napthol.

    You can either leave the coupler dye plus the silver image or bleach the silver. Bob Carlos Clarke used Tetenal's dye coupler kits but they are easy to make up from scratch.

    Ian

  2. #12
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    Ok who here does this , I would like to try .

    From what I gather from Ians reply
    I bleach after my first two toning steps that are sepia then selenium.
    after bleaching I wash for 10min??
    then develop in Alpha- napthol- where do I get this stuff , how do I mix it and dilution. , how long do I develop, do I stop and fix? , or do I just wash after the blue.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    Toning using colour couplers requires a normal rehalogenating bleach - ferricyanide and bromide, then after washing redevelopment in a colour developer with the relevant coupler added, for blue it's αlpha-napthol.

    You can either leave the coupler dye plus the silver image or bleach the silver. Bob Carlos Clarke used Tetenal's dye coupler kits but they are easy to make up from scratch.

    Ian

  3. #13
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    It's something quite different Bob, you'd need to experiment quite a bit first to see how best to use the technique. Alpa-napthol is quite easy to get from a chemical supplier.

    Ian

  4. #14
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    So where do I get some info to lead me in the right direction? I have tons of failed prints to experiment with, more than I should ever admit too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    It's something quite different Bob, you'd need to experiment quite a bit first to see how best to use the technique. Alpa-napthol is quite easy to get from a chemical supplier.

    Ian

  5. #15

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    Two things cross my mind.
    you can't bleach after selenium
    And in reflective colour ie a print, blue and yellow equals green.
    "There are a great many things I am in doubt about at the moment, and I should consider myself favoured if you would kindly enlighten me. Signed, Doubtful, off to Canada." (BJP 1914).

    Regards
    Bill

  6. #16
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Carnie View Post
    So where do I get some info to lead me in the right direction? I have tons of failed prints to experiment with, more than I should ever admit too.
    I'll search, I know I posted the complete technique here on APUG but it may have been lost in a Forum upgrade. I've got the original 1930's article somewhere in a BJPA and it was republished in the 60's. Give me a day or so and I'll post it for you.

    Ian

  7. #17
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    You are the best thanks Ian
    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    I'll search, I know I posted the complete technique here on APUG but it may have been lost in a Forum upgrade. I've got the original 1930's article somewhere in a BJPA and it was republished in the 60's. Give me a day or so and I'll post it for you.

    Ian

  8. #18
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
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    Ok so I am preparing for a show in Riverside CA this September, As well I am visiting Paris and London in September and want to bring a portfolio to show a few gallerys there.

    My quest for quad tone is lets say it in Baseball Terms.. **I am in a slump coach**

    so here is a few observations and I will show you where I want to get with the Jpegs attached.

    Solarization Sabattier is basically a process that once you do it enough times you conclude that at the two ends there are not great highlights and great blacks.

    I like this btw but since everything try's to go to the middle you end up with a masive amount of middle grey.

    I am hoping to see warmth of sepia in the highlights, peach in the upper midtones, and the lower end exhibit blue green.

    The first rule of photographic colour theory is that blue is complementary to Yellow , so immediately I am at odds.
    So I am going to bleach the print and re fix to create an highlight region that is separate from the rest of the tones.
    Here I am going to apply a second round of bleach sepia and put yellow only in the highlight region.

    Then I am going to put the print in gold toner which I know creates a lovely peach colour in the upper midtones.

    Now to the crunch.. if I selenium I get nice colour, but selenium really is a warm tone and not cool , but I want it because of my goals of permanence, Afterwords I would like to introduce blue into the low tones which gives a lovely separation from the warm highlights..

    I have attained this a few times , and when it works its spectacular IMHO, I am using a Matt Ilford Paper which accepts the tone nicely.

    So to get out of the slump, any one here see how I can split easily with toners, I am taking my Tim R and Eddie Ephrams books home to read again but any suggestions would be nice.
    Click image for larger version. 

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  9. #19

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    And you think the exposure forum is complicated?

  10. #20
    brian steinberger's Avatar
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    Bob, I have no problem creating split tones with just sepia then selenium on MGIV. Gold can be used as you say to warm up the sepia toned areas to a peachy color, but can be overdone in my opinion.

    Have you thought about bleaching and re-developing in a re-developing toner such as Eddie mentions in his book "Creative Elements?" I do not have the book in front of me now but I believe the bleach contained 10% hydrochloric bleach and then he re-developed in a developer containing mostly metol. I will have to pull the formula up later. Its in the back of the book under re-developing toners or redevelopers. He claims it creates a bluer color on MGIV, which he says will go even cooler after selenium. This is something I want to try for sure just to achive a truely cold print tone. But I was thinking, after fixing and a wash, bleach and re-develop in this cold tone re-developer, then selenium first to cool your lower midtones and blacks even colder, and then sepia tone just the highlights for a hint of warmth. Just a thought.

    As of now, I'm getting a nice split with sepia toning ever so slightly first then selenium toning for a short time which warms the sepia tones up a bit more and cools the shadows just a bit. But there's a chance that using Eddie's bleach and re-developer formula may create a split closer to what you're looking for. I try to stay away from toners and dyes, which are not archival.

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