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  1. #11
    cliveh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PKM-25 View Post
    Not entirely, I pre-wet FB when I do 20x24's in my Jobo 3063 drum, it has eliminated the developing streak I sometimes had when I did not pre-wet.
    Please describe this developing streak and I and others may be able to advise how this can be avoided without pre-wetting.

    “The contemplation of things as they are, without error or confusion, without substitution or imposture, is in itself a nobler thing than a whole harvest of invention”

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  2. #12

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    I assume the both Kodak and Ilford have a good reason for not recomending pre-soaking.

    Both companies recommend you use of a rapid fixer with T-grain films because silver iodide is slower to remove than either the chloride or bromide salts. A dark stain may indicate insufficient fixing and/or washing. Use of aa alkaline HCA will also reduce the amount of dye. Dye retention is more probable with low pH developers.
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  3. #13

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    I can certainly think of an instance where presoaking might be beneficial - when prematurely "snatch"
    processing to get the silver only marginally developed. In such cases the dev time tends to be very
    short and it's difficult to do it evenly. I put the paper face down and rub it around very quickly to keep
    any air bells from staying put, then quickly flip it over. Doing all that in half a minute or so is a bit tricky (thank goodness, I don't snatch develop very often any more, but "lith" printers might). And presoaking might help both with eveness of development and delay it a bit.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gerald C Koch View Post
    I assume the both Kodak and Ilford have a good reason for not recomending pre-soaking.

    Both companies recommend you use of a rapid fixer with T-grain films because silver iodide is slower to remove than either the chloride or bromide salts. A dark stain may indicate insufficient fixing and/or washing. Use of aa alkaline HCA will also reduce the amount of dye. Dye retention is more probable with low pH developers.
    Ilford doesn't advise against a pre-soak. They say it is simply not required.

  5. #15
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    I am not sure what paper it was, either Agfa MCC, or Ilford Fb where you can presoak it to wash out the incorporated developer or what ever is in there.
    Then you develope it in Lith Developer. I did this a few years ago.

  6. #16

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    I have presoaked FB regularly in my Jobo. I did it to prevent loosing my developer solution too fast. A 16x20 soaks up a lot of developer. I extended development and always got good dmax. But yes it does dilute all the solutions. I've since stopped with no noticeable differences, except that my developer disappears very quickly

  7. #17
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    Pre-soaking FB paper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R 1974 View Post
    Ilford doesn't advise against a pre-soak. They say it is simply not required.
    Exactly. I don't do it for paper, see no reason for it and in fact never heard of it until now. But I generally do pre-soak film for a couple of reasons. One is the tempering mentioned. The other is with rotary processing in my Jobo. Jobo recommended a pre-soak because they found that with most film developer combinations the slowing of development times for a 5 minute pre-soak just about exactly offsets the increased activity from the continuous agitation. This was recommended in the Journal of Rotary Processing and I have found it to be generally true, allowing me to use the same starting times with the Jobo as for inversion. It certainly does no harm.

    I do not use it with Diafine in tanks as the manufacturer specifically recommends against it. Though I haven't tried going against that recommendation it makes sense to me.

  8. #18
    Jon Shiu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R 1974 View Post
    Ilford doesn't advise against a pre-soak. They say it is simply not required.
    Re: pre-rinsing film

    In the Ilford instructions it says a pre-rinse is not recommended due to possible uneven development.

    Jon
    Last edited by Jon Shiu; 04-08-2013 at 10:45 PM. Click to view previous post history.
    Mendocino Coast Black and White Photography: www.jonshiu.com

  9. #19
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    Well I don't really care what they say when I get good results doing it. If I didn't I'd look at that, but I take their instructions as advice, noy orders. Works for me.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jon Shiu View Post
    Re: pre-rinsing film

    In the Ilford instructions it says a pre-rinse is not recommended due to possible uneven development.

    Jon
    I believe that advice is specific to Rotary Tube processing.

    And Simon of Harmann fame just posted today that Ilford doesn't recommend against a pre-rinse, it just is of the opinion that none is required when developing film.
    Matt

    “Photography is a complex and fluid medium, and its many factors are not applied in simple sequence. Rather, the process may be likened to the art of the juggler in keeping many balls in the air at one time!”

    Ansel Adams, from the introduction to The Negative - The New Ansel Adams Photography Series / Book 2

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