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  1. #51
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markbarendt View Post
    With respect Ian, is that quote supposed to be some kind of objective proof?
    No, not at all but I suggest having an open mind when it comes to Pyro developers, I was highly sceptical until I tried Pyrocat. A friend had tried to persuade me to try a Pyrogallol based developer about 10 years earlier but I was very happy with my developers. In hindsight I wish I'd tried Pyro devs earlier.

    I wouldn't be using Pyrocat if I didn't think it had benefits over my previous developers.

    Ian

  2. #52

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    Ian - just out of curiosity why did you choose Pyrocat vs a Pyrogallol or a Pyrogallol-Metol developer such as WD2D/(H) or PMK? As you know Phenidone-Catechol is a somewhat different animal.

  3. #53
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R 1974 View Post
    Ian - just out of curiosity why did you choose Pyrocat vs a Pyrogallol or a Pyrogallol-Metol developer such as WD2D/(H) or PMK? As you know Phenidone-Catechol is a somewhat different animal.
    I think it was because of very good reports about Pyrocat on this forum (not long after I joined) and the level headed way that Sandy King writes about it. I did consider PMK but I had everything I needed on the shelf for Pyrocat. Sodium Metaborate has never been as widely available here in the UK compared to the US although Kodak Ltd used to sell it, I always made my own from Borax and Sodium Hydroxide.

    In addition I was already using a Pyrocatechin re-developing toner (Ilford IT-8) so was aware of the staining effects, and I'd also used the Windisch Compensating developer and the US version of the same Windisch developer (which was a mistake where the weights of Sulphite and Pyrocatechin were transposed).

    Another reason for choosing Pyrocat was that Pyrocatechin is itself a fine grain developing agent on it's own or in combination with Metol, Phenidone, paraphenylene diame etc.

    Ian

  4. #54

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    Yes, pyrocat seems to have a lot of great benefits which add up to something more than their parts.

    I'd also consider dd-x if it was even remotely affordable in Australia.

  5. #55
    markbarendt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ian Grant View Post
    No, not at all but I suggest having an open mind when it comes to Pyro developers, I was highly sceptical until I tried Pyrocat. A friend had tried to persuade me to try a Pyrogallol based developer about 10 years earlier but I was very happy with my developers. In hindsight I wish I'd tried Pyro devs earlier.

    I wouldn't be using Pyrocat if I didn't think it had benefits over my previous developers.

    Ian
    I'm open to trying them Ian.

    I have WD2D+ on hand that I play with here and there. I tried some Rollo Pyro a while back too and I do have negatives that I like from each of these developers, but they haven't proven any easier to print or better for me than companion shots done with Xtol, D-76, or DD-X.

    I've found that with at least WD2D+ and Rollo Pyro, it's also a lot of work to get things right for each film. Steve's description above is a good reinforcement of that thought.

    It seems to me that I have to be more careful shooting, developing, and in which films I choose. For example I found Delta 100 actually worked quite nicely for me in WD2D+, I like FP4+ more though and it wasn't any better in the staining developers, wasn't worse either. For faster films though; HP5+, Delta 400, and 3200 I really find DD-X and Xtol are a better fit for me; in both the EI's it allows me to shoot at and in ease of printing.
    Mark Barendt, Ignacio, CO

    "We do not see things the way they are. We see things the way we are." Anaïs Nin

  6. #56
    jstraw's Avatar
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    Ok...a couple of questions:

    My Pyrocat MC turns lavender shortly after I mix it. Is this normal?

    I'm getting mottled staining. I think this may be from the period of time the emulsion is exposed to air when I drain the developer and add the stop....and maybe due also to inadequate fixing. Thoughts?

    I'm about to run another test with a change of process...taking the film from the developer straight to a stop tank with only a couple of seconds exposure to the air.
    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetuer adipiscing elit. In velit arcu, consequat at, interdum sit amet, consequat in, quam.

  7. #57
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jstraw View Post
    Ok...a couple of questions:

    My Pyrocat MC turns lavender shortly after I mix it. Is this normal?

    I'm getting mottled staining. I think this may be from the period of time the emulsion is exposed to air when I drain the developer and add the stop....and maybe due also to inadequate fixing. Thoughts?

    I'm about to run another test with a change of process...taking the film from the developer straight to a stop tank with only a couple of seconds exposure to the air.
    This is exactly the problem that I had, with mottled development.

    The Pyrocat mixed first as green, and it would turn color after a little while to almost black. I bought a new kit and it mixed green again. But it didn't help my developing problems any. I tried distilled water, which also didn't help. I can't even remember all that I tried anymore. Sorry I'm not of more help.

    It could be that one of your solutions are contaminated, or it could be that you're not using enough agitation. I never solved this problem.
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh

  8. #58
    Ian Grant's Avatar
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    When I mix my Pyrocat HC it initially turns a very light ble/green colour then clears. However if the Metabisulphite has decomposed completely Pyrocat does turn a more noticeable blue/green which doesn't clear and this is an indication that the Pyrocatechin has started to oxidise and it'll stain the negatives often unevenly. It's a bit subjective but a slight colour on mixing isn't an issue but if it's quite noticeable then I'd discard and make fresh Part A.

    My first batch was stored in small Polythene bottles and went off very quickly a couple of months as the polythene was low density and allowed oxygen migration through the walls. In decent "High Density" bottles I have Pyrocat HD that's lasted over 2 years (no glycol). The fresher the Metabisulphite the longer these developers last as stock or in a dish/tank during processing.

    When I use IT-8 a Pyrocatechin re-developing toner the developer has a remarkably short tray life and once it turns in colour stains the prints patchily.

    Ian

  9. #59
    jstraw's Avatar
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    I don't make it. I buy it from Formulary. I may have a bad batch. Great.

    It doesn't mix green. It mixes clear and turns lavender before I get the film into the soup.
    Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetuer adipiscing elit. In velit arcu, consequat at, interdum sit amet, consequat in, quam.

  10. #60
    Thomas Bertilsson's Avatar
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    I hope you can sort it out, jstraw.

    When Pyrocat works it's a very nice developer. I suspect that I'm not crafty enough to make sure my chemistry is tip top at all times, so I have to go with commercial off the shelf stuff to have a better chance at consistent negatives.
    "Often moments come looking for us". - Robert Frank

    "Make good art!" - Neil Gaiman

    "...the heart and mind are the true lens of the camera". - Yousuf Karsh



 

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