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  1. #1
    NikoSperi's Avatar
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    Technical Pan in Rodinal - help!

    Just tried Technical Pan in Rodinal - result: One less roll of TP at my disposal. Any experts out there to help?

    Here's the deal:
    TP exposed at 25 EI
    Rodinal 1:300 and 12 minutes as per one version of digital truth. (The other version says 30 minutes)

    Problem arises IMO because to develop one roll of 135 requires 300ml of soup in the tank. At 1:300 dilution, that's one milliliter of Rodinal. Agfa on old tech sheets said you needed 10ml per roll in your soup. However, at 1:300 dilution, that would require a tank that holds 3 liters!

    TP is a microfilm high contrast emulsion, and to get a continuous tone result, it appears you need to severely dilute the developer. But at 1ml:300ml for one roll, the results aren't thin, they're transparent!

    Has anybody done this before? Help!

    Is it about the absolute amount of developer? Do I need 3 liters of solution for one roll?
    If you tone it down alot, it almost becomes bearable.

    - Walker Evans on using color

  2. #2
    roy
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    How was it ruined ? I have looked at some notes from a workshop I attended a few years ago given by a photographer who produced really nice results with Techpan. Because of the contrast element he used dilutions ranging from 1ml Rodinal to 75 or even 100ml water with vigorous agitation for 35mm film and times ranging from 3.5 to 4mins. He found it very water sensitive and on occasions used higher dilutions and even slower film speeds. One of those films you have to experiment with in different lighting conditions depending on what your photography is.
    Roy Groombridge.

    Cogito, ergo sum.
    (Descartes)

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    Dear NikoSperi,

    I have no help to give you, but I await with interest your final results.

    Neal Wydra

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    Ruined = severely underdeveloped. Even the exposed leader remains translucent and pale.
    If you tone it down alot, it almost becomes bearable.

    - Walker Evans on using color

  5. #5
    NikoSperi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neal
    I have no help to give you, but I await with interest your final results.
    Freerider!
    I foresee two possible outcomes: a) I nail it and become the resident expert at extremely dilute dev't of discontinued films... or more likely b) I finish my limited stash of TechPan trying to get a half-decent result...
    If you tone it down alot, it almost becomes bearable.

    - Walker Evans on using color

  6. #6

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    Try this.

    Here are two ideas that I have used that work.

    Mr. David Kachel recommends the following...This technique is known as SLIMT...selective latent image manipulation techniques if I remember correctly

    1. Soak your Tech pan in water and photo flo for several minutes for the most even development. I never bothered with this step myself.

    2. Soak your film for 4 to 5 minutes in a .2% potassium ferricyanide bleach.
    You can make this by putting 2 grams of PF into a liter of water. He further recommends 1/3 as much potaasium bromide as PF. I always used just the PF. These two ingredients are what is in Kodak's Sepia Toner. In case you do not have a scale: I do not know how much PF is in the pakage as I made my SLIMT from raw chemicals. I imagine someone else on Apug will tell you. If not Kodak will. If you have access to a metric scale you can weigh the ingredients; Otherwise you can make a stock solution from the entire kit and make your SLIMT with further dilution He recommends a delveloping time of 12 minutes for HC110B with normal agitation. I used to develop this in 1:50 Rodinal but no longer remember my time. If you find a film that lists both Rodinal and HC110b developing times, correlate that and develop a test strip first..say four frames. For instance if a regular pan film shows rodinal at 1:50 requiring 16 minutes and HC110b requiring 10 minutes then your test would be 16/10X12 minutes. This is capable of working easily and dependably with normal agitation once you have worked out your times.

    The very nicest method that I have used to develop Tech Pan comes from Hans Frederich. Develop the film in C-41 (Flexicolor) developer with convential B&W stop batn and fixer. For your first test develop for 10 minutes at 68ºF. I would lay my tank, with the lid on, on its side, rolling it slowly back and forth in a water bath. This provides Tech Pan negatives with wonderful gradation. You can try a film speed of 50. In my opinion this method beats the crap out of Technidol.

    A few thoughts about TP:
    TP is still available at about $75 for a bulk roll. A bulk roll is 150 feet long. this should provide approx. 27 36x rolls. TP can be frozen and have an
    exceptionally long life.

    TP negatives will tend to look underexposed compared to other films since it has such little base density. Do not be mislead.

    I imagine that you already realize that TP, with its extended red sensitivity,
    has unusual gradation...reds lighter than normal, blues and greens darker than normal. To have a normal appearance use a CC40 Cyan filter w/o any filter factor.

    As long as you have gone this far, use your camera with the mirror locked up on the mother of all tripods.

    Enjoy.

  7. #7

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    Dear Nikosperi,

    I admit it. I am a lazy fellow.<g> I am interested in hearing how TechPan fares in Rodinal as more of a general interest topic rather than acutal use. For TechPan I use C-41 developer (advised in an old issue of Photo Techniques). As a lazy fellow I waited for another more ambitious fellow I know to actually verify how well it worked. 10 minutes at 68°F for EI 25. Works great. I still have some Technidol, but I think that might be more fun to experiment with on other emulsions.<g>

    Good luck!

    Neal

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    roy
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikoSperi
    Just tried Technical Pan in Rodinal - result: One less roll of TP at my disposal. Any experts out there to help?
    Do I need 3 liters of solution for one roll?
    At a 1:300 dilution, that is nowhere like 3 litres of water, that would be 1:3000,unless I have mistaken your posting. My 35mm developing tank is marked to hold less than 300 ml of liquid so, on that basis, it would get 3 ml of Rodinal as I can, in fact, squeeze the extra in.
    Roy Groombridge.

    Cogito, ergo sum.
    (Descartes)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neal
    Dear Nikosperi,

    I still have some Technidol, but I think that might be more fun to experiment with on other emulsions.<g>

    Good luck!

    Neal
    Has Technidol also been discontinued? I have half a freezer full of Tech Pan, but only a few jars of Technidol.

    David.

  10. #10

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    From what I understand, technidol will be around a while. Formulary has their own brand as well. Plus there are formulas in the "Cookbooks" for document films.

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