Yes, I did two films to a reel in a 500ml Paterson tank. Wind in one film, use the tape at the end of that to stick the next film to the end of the first one, continue walking the films in. Works just fine after a little practice - but when it doesn't work, give up at onve. Don't try to force it, just roll up the second film again and save it till later or you have a good chance of damaging both films!
That's why I always shot three rolls of anything important. But I never damaged any of those rolls, just my "personal" work...
-- Ole Tjugen, Luddite Elitist
I don't know if Ole is using 120 or 220 reels. I have some old 220 reels (I think that there are six Nikkor-Honeywells left). It might be a good experiment. Logically, with 500ml of mixed dev you should be able to do 2-120 films (~160 sq inches, same as 2-35mm, 36 exp). Total time may be longer with 2 rolls per reel, Ole would have a better idea about that. Shoot some tests and see how it works.
Originally Posted by PCGraflex
I'm in the process of switching to Pyrocat, My local photo stores have started doubling the price of ilfosol-S ($10 US/bottle). B&H won't ship it anymore. Adorama will ship but with shipping (ground) I need to buy 5 at a time to get it below $10 US/bottle.
Mostly I'm doing sheets these days (4x5). Using the hp-combi dip and dunk method described by Eugene on www.largeformatphotography.info. This requires 1L of working dev (100ml of ilfosol) per six sheets of 4x5. The dev can be reused, but I've never done it. At $5 US/bottle, I wasn't too worried about using it as a one shot. At $10 US/bottle The dev is almost costing as much as the film.
Originally Posted by Ole
Yes, I understand how to put two rolls on one reel. My question is, with two films on one reel in a 500ml tank, what is the capacity of Ilfosol-S? Did you have to extend development? If one can develop 2-120 films on 500ml of working developer then 20 films at 1:9 isn't out of line.
I guess I could always move to something a bit more economical in the future but I do like the convenience of liquids. I used to use UNIVERSAL years ago and that was pretty cheap. That's why I went with Ilfosol-S. Found out Ifosol-S is $7.99 locally here.
I might just have to follow your advice and test a couple of rolls in 500ml of developer.
Unless you you're shooting just for fun, I'd be wary of exceeding manufacturers recommendations which are 16x120. You probably can get 20x120 out of a bottle but I wouldn't risk it on anything other than easily recreated shots.
Originally Posted by PCGraflex
I frequently process my own c41 color film, and I've pushed that developer by about the same margin you're thinking of on many occasions. It worked fine - until one day it didn't and I ended up with a processed blank piece of film.
I think the manufacturers build in a safety margin as they expect some bottles to be mistreated. With the safety margin they will still work notwitstanding the mistreatment. You will never know when you've received a mistreated bottle until it is too late.
If 500ml of concentrate will process 16 films (one-shot use) then each film requires 500ml/16 = 31.25ml of concentrate. At 1+9 that makes a minimum of 312.5ml of mixed developer per film. As long as you use at least 312.5ml of mixed developer per film (at 1+9) then you will be OK (in practice, I'm sure 300ml per film will do just fine)
So, if your developer tank requires 500ml to cover the two films, you need to add approx 100ml more to give the required 300ml per film. If you need 1000ml to cover the two films then you are still OK but have wasted about 400ml of developer in which case, switching to the 1+14 dilution might make more sense; more developer than you need is obviously wasteful, but will not effect results
To double-check the maths: 500ml mixed at 1+9 = 5000ml: 5000ml/16films = 312.5ml per film. 500ml mixed at 1+14 = 7500ml: 7500ml/16films = 468.75ml per film.
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Originally Posted by Bob F.
Yes, now I see the problem most clearly. It looks like 16 films is the max and doing them one at a time seems to make the most sense as Graham has suggested also. I guess I wanted to load up the reels and get the most done per run. I will be moving to rotary processing when I get my CPP-2 up and running anyway. That's why the questions regardign two films on one reel and developer capacity. I also want to try DD-X as that looks to be more economical.
Thanks to you and Graham and Ole and JmDavis and ...