Switch to English Language Passer en langue française Omschakelen naar Nederlandse Taal Wechseln Sie zu deutschen Sprache Passa alla lingua italiana
Members: 70,197   Posts: 1,531,433   Online: 827
      
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 20 of 20
  1. #11
    Les McLean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Northern England on the Scottish border
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,610
    I agree with the general feeling here that each image should be printed on a the paper most suited to that image, but that means stocking more papers and stretching of budgets. How about stocking one warm tone paper and using different techniques and methods to control the print colour, for example, using a blue/black developer or gold toning to cool the paper, adding benzotiazole will also cool the paper and increase the contrast. As has already been suggested split selenium and gold to cool the highlights and leave the shadows warm. This may not be the perfect solution perhaps one worth consideration.

    For what it's worth I prefer to print my documentary work on cool tone paper, preferably Graded Oriental Seagull.
    "Digital circuits are made from analogue parts"
    Fourtune Cookie-Brooklyn May 2006

    Website: www.lesmcleanphotography.com

  2. #12

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,670
    Why not a neutral black tone. By the proper selection of a paper and developer and if needed by adjusting the amount of bromide and benzotriazole in the developer you should be able to get a pure neutral black.

    I personally think that street scenes would look strange if printed in warm black.

  3. #13

    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Seattle
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    78
    Images
    13

    The responses so far to my original query

    I want to sincerely, sincerely thank everyone to this point for their thoughts. Many of the responders have urged me to print the image on the paper it requires, letting the individual image be the guide.

    The problem I think is that single bodies of work on display in galleries (which is my goal with this single body of work), cannot (by convention) be printed on different papers. And most gallery owners are conventional to that degree. (I actually agree with that convention).

    I believe that I am forced into this dichotomous position.

    But it is true that the warm tone paper (not brown tone), like Agfa MCC, when bathed in 1:12 selenium for 5-6 minutes, gives a very dark tone, a brownish black, in the shadows. I have never done Gold after selenium.

  4. #14
    panchromatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Lansdale, PA
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    218
    Images
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Grenell
    I want to sincerely, sincerely thank everyone to this point for their thoughts. Many of the responders have urged me to print the image on the paper it requires, letting the individual image be the guide.

    The problem I think is that single bodies of work on display in galleries (which is my goal with this single body of work), cannot (by convention) be printed on different papers. And most gallery owners are conventional to that degree. (I actually agree with that convention).

    I believe that I am forced into this dichotomous position.

    But it is true that the warm tone paper (not brown tone), like Agfa MCC, when bathed in 1:12 selenium for 5-6 minutes, gives a very dark tone, a brownish black, in the shadows. I have never done Gold after selenium.

    If this is your case, then choose one, either warm or cold, and then pick images that fit that style of paper. Just another thought.
    --Ryan

    "The negative is the equivalent of the composer's score, and the print the performance." ~Ansel Adams

  5. #15
    titrisol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Rotterdam
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    1,671
    Images
    8
    Lowel Huff (Clayton Chem) was nice enough to send me some of their cold-tone paper developer. It gives AGFA MCC a bluish tinge that I liked a lot.
    You may use that one to control tone of your images.

    Also Ethol LPD can be used to control tone, 1+1 gives neutral blacks in MCC, 1+4 warm blacks.

    PS. convention about using only one type of paper?????????????????
    that sounds like asking a painter to use only 3 colors


    Quote Originally Posted by Gary Grenell
    I want to sincerely, sincerely thank everyone to this point for their thoughts. Many of the responders have urged me to print the image on the paper it requires, letting the individual image be the guide.

    The problem I think is that single bodies of work on display in galleries (which is my goal with this single body of work), cannot (by convention) be printed on different papers. And most gallery owners are conventional to that degree. (I actually agree with that convention).

    I believe that I am forced into this dichotomous position.

    But it is true that the warm tone paper (not brown tone), like Agfa MCC, when bathed in 1:12 selenium for 5-6 minutes, gives a very dark tone, a brownish black, in the shadows. I have never done Gold after selenium.
    Mama took my APX away.....

  6. #16

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Århus, Denmark
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    2,102
    Images
    16
    I use cold tone mainly because I started out using Tetenal Eukobrom and never felt the need to change...I still use it and I am HAPPY.

  7. #17

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    15
    You might want to try Prestige fiber base VC by Bergger photo, great paper with lots of tone, not too warm or too cold, I like it a lot.

  8. #18
    Magnus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Munich, Germany
    Shooter
    Multi Format
    Posts
    58
    I use normal tone, cold tone and warm tone papers, all VC and one can ofcourse follow the "standards" which to use for what, but for me .... I use them according to my mood. I will print a negative normally on normal tone, but might divert to cold-tone or warmtone, or all three and see which suits my current mood best and work the print out further, the results are always good because you follow your own heart at that particular moment in time.... looking back at some prints I've done in the past, some might be questionable, but always interesting..... and near all have at least captured an "atmosphere" if only a reflection of the mood I was in at that moment in time.
    What Ansel or HCB did with their.... thats their thing not mine, but theres no one telling me what to print on what, with what ... thats what makes B&W DIY photography interesting.... I for one do it for myself, not for others ....

  9. #19
    Bob Carnie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Toronto-Ontario
    Shooter
    Med. Format RF
    Posts
    4,649
    Images
    14
    Hi Gary

    the list you provided was interesting , but I would be careful as a coldtone print could be made to look warm tone at the book stage. I do not think one paper is more suitable unless you think so. You will notice a few posters have mentioned cold tone paper for street scenes or documentary. I would look at prints made by photographers you admire in the genre that your work is and make your selection then.

    I am of the opinion * not * to change papers within a body of work and as well when printing a show I keep the first approved toned print on the wall directly opposite my wash area where I judge wet prints. I use this as my basic guide for the rest of the prints in the show.
    If I go into a gallery and see a hogepoge of different papers ,toners of one persons work I pay little attention to it. I hope this dosen't sound snobbish to you but IMO you would be crazy to mix and match papers and toners within a body of work.
    Not to say to test like crazy before you start printing as this is exactly what I do before every large show for clients we look at different methods of producing the imagery.
    My worst nightmare is when a casual client has worked with me over a period of years,trying out dev, papers tones, decides to have a show and uses past work. It is a bloody disastor and I hate it.
    hope this helps

  10. #20

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Vermont
    Shooter
    Medium Format
    Posts
    348
    Images
    5
    First of all, at least half of the photographers' work you mentioned was originally printed on cold tone papers. For some reason, the monographs are warmer in tone. I know Jock Sturges work personally, and his is warmtone, and the subject matter warrants it. Strand used a lot of cold tone paper, except of course the platinum work, and some of his Southwest stuff. Arbus - cold tone. Etc.

    Some of the most beautiful street work was done by Roy de Carava. He printed "down" on Ilford Galerie #1. The prints are very slightly olive in tone, but not exactly warm. The Ilford papers tend to run on the fence between cold and warm. I'm talking about Multigrade FB, Galerie, and the former Ilfobrom. Their papers all seem to yield good shadow detail, and can be toned effectively to give various hues. Galerie especially responds to selenium, without going purple as fast as say, Oriental or Polymax. In fact, If I had to do your particular task, I'd be tempted to use Galerie (even though it's not VC) and give a 3 to 5 minute toning in weakish selenium.

    I feel Ansel Adams was one of the great printers of portfolios, in terms of technical beauty and marvellous consistency. His book on The Print has info about some of his production techniques. You want your prints to have a uniform look, so the body of work "holds together". I would avoid double or split toning as there a lot of variables, and the net benefits might not outweigh the hassles. The most important thing you need in these prints is great tonal rendition and proper contrast, whether you like harsh or soft doesn't matter, as long as it's clean and gets the image across. Concentrate on your printing skills - exposure, development, reading the wet print, allowing for drydown, toning, and finally, how they look in the mats you've chosen. Almost any high quality paper made today is capable of giving you what you need - but you must pick one and master it.
    Robert Hunt

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12


 

APUG PARTNERS EQUALLY FUNDING OUR COMMUNITY:



Contact Us  |  Support Us!  |  Advertise  |  Site Terms  |  Archive  —   Search  |  Mobile Device Access  |  RSS  |  Facebook  |  Linkedin