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  1. #1

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    developing paper for adjacency effects

    Can we enhance the acutance of prints by developing the paper for adjacency effects? I've heard that a water bath technique will do this to some extent though I've never tried it. Recently I've been semi-stand developing my film in highly dilute deceloper for about an hour to promote adjacency effects among other things and it surprised me that I've never heard of anyone developing paper for an hour for any reason (other than lith printing).

    Is anyone using highly dilute paper developers for extended periods of time or any other unique developing techniques to promote adjacency effects and acutance in their prints?

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    In extensive studies at EK, it was found that adjacency (egde) effects introduced into print materials intended for non-projection viewing (B&W and color prints on paper support), had no significant impact on visual sharpness.

    OTOH, interimage effects did improve color quality as expected in color print materials.

    If anyone can prove otherwise, I would be VERY interested in the results as I worked on this project for quite some time.

    PE

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    Thanks. I didn't expect to find anyone who had looked at quantitative data on the subject.

    That's interesting and unexpected that it wouldn't be significant for non-projection viewing. Not to be argumentative, but I thought people like Sandy King who contact print big negatives are getting noticeable adjacency effects in their work. If you can see it in contact printed film, shouldn't you be able to get the effects in paper development? After all, the size and scale are the same.

    What's EK by the way?

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    lee
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    EK=Eastman Kodak

    lee\c

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarred McCaffrey
    Thanks. I didn't expect to find anyone who had looked at quantitative data on the subject.

    That's interesting and unexpected that it wouldn't be significant for non-projection viewing. Not to be argumentative, but I thought people like Sandy King who contact print big negatives are getting noticeable adjacency effects in their work. If you can see it in contact printed film, shouldn't you be able to get the effects in paper development? After all, the size and scale are the same.

    What's EK by the way?
    Adjacency effects are a condition of film development and not of paper development. Adjacency effects are apparent in both projection printing and contact printing...however the effects noted are a condition of film, film developer, and film development methods.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald Miller
    Adjacency effects are a condition of film development and not of paper development. Adjacency effects are apparent in both projection printing and contact printing...however the effects noted are a condition of film, film developer, and film development methods.
    And Donald, what is it that makes film so much more different than paper in this respect? I see no reason why paper can not have adjacency effects. It may just not be as visible due to the lack of enlargement.

    You appear to be contradicting Kodak's research as stated above as well.

    Kirk - www.keyesphoto.com

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    PE quote: "

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    In extensive studies at EK, it was found that adjacency (egde) effects introduced into print materials intended for non-projection viewing (B&W and color prints on paper support), had no significant impact on visual sharpness.

    OTOH, interimage effects did improve color quality as expected in color print materials.

    If anyone can prove otherwise, I would be VERY interested in the results as I worked on this project for quite some time.

    PE

    Kirk,

    Perhaps you and I are interperting this to mean something entirely different. I read it to mean that Kodak spent some time researching this and found the results to be "no significant impact"...

    At any rate, if you decide to spend time doing further research on this, I look forward to your results. Have a great day.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarred McCaffrey
    Thanks. I didn't expect to find anyone who had looked at quantitative data on the subject.

    That's interesting and unexpected that it wouldn't be significant for non-projection viewing. Not to be argumentative, but I thought people like Sandy King who contact print big negatives are getting noticeable adjacency effects in their work. If you can see it in contact printed film, shouldn't you be able to get the effects in paper development? After all, the size and scale are the same.

    What's EK by the way?
    I think Sandy will tell you that adjacency effects are not as niticeable in lerge formats as in small. The actual effect is the same for both, given the same emulsion and development, but the effect is multiplied by the enlarged print of the smaller negative.

    Paper emulsions are, I expect, much thinner than film emulsions because light goes through them twice to produce the visible image. I would expect the size of adjacency distortions (which after all is what they are) to be smaller the thinner an emulsion is, so that even if the film emulsion were coated on paper, and if the development were the same in both cases, the adjacency effect would be of smaller scale on the paper. Perhaps one could test this by using printing paper as film in a view camera to see if a given treatment will produce similar adjacency effects on both film and paper negatives.
    Gadget Gainer

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    Here are two answers applicable to all of the above.

    1. At normal magnification of prints (viewing an 8x10 at arms lenth for example), the tiny edge effects in the print itself are insignificant. But when enlarging a 35mm negative, that tiny effect in the negative becomes much larger so you 'see' the effects caused in the negative but cannot see them if caused in the print (all things being equal)

    2. The BromoIodide film emulsions generate a HUGE edge effect compared to the ChloroBromide paper emulsions. The Iodide ion is the main source of this edge effect with bromide coming in second. Paper emulsions are mostly chloride with some bromide added. This gives rise to much less potential for edge effects, and when it does take place it is on a macro scale rather than on a micro scale. Therefore it shows up more as bromide drag (in high bromide papers for example) than as an edge effect. (Bromide drag is a MACRO manifiestation of an edge effect BTW).

    So, papers are not known for either edge effects or interimage effects (in color papers).

    That is not to say you cannot get them, just that they are not normally significant at normal magnifications using normal paper emulsions.

    As I said above, if you can demonstrate this, I want to see it!

    PE

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    Thanks for the bromoidide vs chlorobromide info. That clarifies things quite a bit. The scale and magnification of edge effects is an interesting creative issue to deal with. I guess 35mm has an advantage in this discussion.

    I think the simplest way to test this and experiment would be to play with knife edge exposures and/or step tablets. The next time I print I'll have to try a few things to entertain my curiosity.

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