Harvey's 777

[c6h6o3]

I will have to figure out how to store 4 gallons in my little apartment. Wine in a box bladders is one way.

No, you won't. The 4 gallon case consists of 4 1-gallon packages in a box. Each 1 gallon package is further subdivided into bags of powders for the A and B solutions which when in solution you combine to form working 777. I only mix up 1 gallon at a time.

[Venchka]

Thank you, thank you! That is a load off of my mind!

I assume you divide the 1 gallon into working stock and replenisher?

Finding 1 or 3 friends to split the 4 gallons would bring the cost down further.

[c6h6o3]

Thank you, thank you! That is a load off of my mind!

I assume you divide the 1 gallon into working stock and replenisher?

Finding 1 or 3 friends to split the 4 gallons would bring the cost down further.

No, you mix up another gallon to use as replenisher. But I only replenish every 7 or 8 sheets (or rolls). My replenisher is always oxidized before the developer deteriorates due to the ever increasing percentage of my replenisher jug which is air. 777 is very sensitive to air. Keep the bottles full.

Really, guys, as Fred points out, it's not that expensive because you're not one shotting it.

[BILL3075]

Has anyone using 777 tried PF's version of this developer?
And does anyone know how it compares with the Bluegrass version?

Thanks,
BILL

[Venchka]

No, you mix up another gallon to use as replenisher. But I only replenish every 7 or 8 sheets (or rolls). My replenisher is always oxidized before the developer deteriorates due to the ever increasing percentage of my replenisher jug which is air. 777 is very sensitive to air. Keep the bottles full.

Really, guys, as Fred points out, it's not that expensive because you're not one shotting it.

OK, in that case I can fill a wine bladder with replenisher and there won't be any oxidation. Add replenisher when the working container needs topping up. A plan!

[Venchka]

Has anyone using 777 tried PF's version of this developer?
And does anyone know how it compares with the Bluegrass version?

Thanks,
BILL

What name does PF use? Where do we look in their catalog?

[Venchka]

Found it. Harvey's Defender 777. Substantially more expensive.

[Fred De Van]

No, you mix up another gallon to use as replenisher. But I only replenish every 7 or 8 sheets (or rolls). My replenisher is always oxidized before the developer deteriorates due to the ever increasing percentage of my replenisher jug which is air. 777 is very sensitive to air. Keep the bottles full.

Really, guys, as Fred points out, it's not that expensive because you're not one shotting it.

BPI did make a dedicated real repenisher. I know, I still have some.

Ask BPI if they will make a run of pure real repenisher if there is sufficient demand. The use of real replinsher makes 777 even cheaper to use. You add only 3/4 ounce per 80 Sq. In. ( 80 Sq. In = 4 sheets of 4x5, 1 roll of 120, 1 36 exp. 35mm film). Actual replenisher is much more desirable than using fresh developer. You can tell them apart by the color of the labels. One is red the other blue.

777 is definitely NOT!!! sensitive to air. Because of the PPD it does normally discolor, but this has NO effect on its working ability.

It certainly was not a good practice but, many users left 3.5 gallon tanks of the stuff totally uncovered for days with NO ill effect. I would mix up 3 gallons of developer and one gallon of replenisher at a time. Months later it was normal for me to go on a months long trip to the other side of the world, and/or spend months shooting only Kodachrome and the other chrome films. It was common especially in the summer that the 1/4 filled bottle of 777 replenisher to sit unused for months. Over decades of this there was NEVER a problem, and I never heard of anyone else encountering a problem.

A tank with a floating lid may easily end whatever you are experiencing. The lid (with a layer of Saran wrap under it) will follow the level of what you have in it. Adding glass marbles is a heavy way of excluding air but usable, and so is the light weight cure of displacing the air with nitrogen or other inert gas, if using bottles. 777 was the standard developer for thousands of NY studio photographers, and most the legendary iconic fashion images could not have been made without it. There were far more people using it (but for reasons that no longer apply) within the photo community than not. It was seldom advertised, and as such, was transparent and invisable to the mass media hobby magazines. Advertising the stuff made little sense and resulted in a contradiction anyway. It is no exageration for me or many others to state that we changed cars more often than we changed our 777.

A simple solution is to use 3 quart bottles and 2 pint bottles in place of a gallon bottle which will eventually fill with air. Even when you are down to the final dregs of the gallon, you simply use ever smaller bottles. You use it so slowly, even this is not any hassle at all. An emmently simple cure to what seems to be vexing imponderable.

"I only replenish every 7 or 8 sheets (or rolls)"

That statement only equates if your sheets are 8x10. Either way, you are replenishing too little especially if you are using 1 gallon or less of developer.


Fred

[nworth]

I've seen a number of different formulas for 777, and that may be part of the confusion I see here. One group are simple metol based developers with added sulfates - really very much like D-23 with added sulfate for high temperature processing. These at least conform to the name "Harvey's Panthermic 777." A similar Edwal product was Edwal Themofine. The other group of formulas are based on p-phenylene diamine and also contain metol, glycin, or both. They are pretty much classic superfine grain formulas (but not extreme superfine grain, like pure PPD developers), roughly Sease No. 4 plus metol. Edwal 12 is similar to these. These are very different developers.

[c6h6o3]

A plan!

and an excellent one. I've been using half gallon jugs.

How do I get the developer into the bladder once I've emptied it?