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  1. #11
    Flotsam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asaphoto
    Is there any difference at all though between the stuff packaged as Efke and the stuff packaged an Adox?
    According to JandC, just the packaging.
    That is called grain. It is supposed to be there.
    =Neal W.=

  2. #12
    Dave Krueger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scootermm
    ...(Ive used the efke/adox with PyroHD only)...
    I've read that a hardening fixer is recommended with the adox/efke films because they have more fragile emulsions. I also undestand that Pyrocat HD is best used without hardener in the fix because the hardener reduces the stain. So... Do you use a hardening fixer when you develop efke/adox with pyrocat HD? I'd also be interested in opinons from others on this question.

    -Dave

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Krueger
    I've read that a hardening fixer is recommended with the adox/efke films because they have more fragile emulsions. I also undestand that Pyrocat HD is best used without hardener in the fix because the hardener reduces the stain. So... Do you use a hardening fixer when you develop efke/adox with pyrocat HD? I'd also be interested in opinons from others on this question.

    -Dave
    I have posted on this subject many times before. I use a lot of 8x10, 5x7 and 4x5 Efke sheet film. The Efke emusions are soft so they require careful handling. If you scratch the emulsion before or during development, post development hardening will not help!

    I develop Efke films in Pyrocat-HD which tans and slightly hardens the emulsion gelatin.

    In general, I would not expect a hardening fixer to reduce the amount of Pyrocat's stain - however, if the fixer's pH is too low (i.e. if the fixer is too acidic) that might reduce the stain.

    I do not use a hardening fixer with Efke films. I use a buffered neutral pH ammonium thiosulfate based rapid fixer. When I Develop film By Inspection (DBI) I use a weak acid stop bath to stop the development process, otherwise I use a water rinse instead of a stop bath.

    I do not have problems with scratched, nicked or gouged emulsions - the secret is in being careful and learning good film handling techniques.

    At Michael and Paula's Sedona (AZ) workshop (January 2006) I watched Paula Chamlee tray develop a large stack of Efke 8x10 sheets (10 or more) in Pyrocat - without a single emulsion defect.
    Tom Hoskinson
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  4. #14
    Alex Hawley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Hoskinson
    I do not have problems with scratched, nicked or gouged emulsions - the secret is in being careful and learning good film handling techniques.

    At Michael and Paula's Sedona (AZ) workshop (January 2006) I watched Paula Chamlee tray develop a large stack of Efke 8x10 sheets (10 or more) in Pyrocat - without a single emulsion defect.
    Wow! 10 sheets. I'll have to remember that.

    Sandy King has been the one who advocates using a non-hardening fixer with Pyrocat-HD. Seeing as he invented the developer, I highly respect his opinion concerning hardening fixers and reduction of stain.

    The other alternative to tray developing is using one of the tube techniques. Unless I go on a several-day binge, I rarely have enough sheets to develop 6 or more sheets at a time. And I don't like having to wait several weeks until I do. I've been using the Extreme Minimal Agitation technique (got a sheet cookin' as we speak) with Efke/Adox. Believe me, it works well (excuse me for a minute while I go agitate). Nary a scratched neg. To learn about this technique, search the B&W Darkroom forum for and look for posts by Steve Sherman or Sandy King.
    Semper Fi & God Bless America
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  5. #15
    c6h6o3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Hoskinson
    At Michael and Paula's Sedona (AZ) workshop (January 2006) I watched Paula Chamlee tray develop a large stack of Efke 8x10 sheets (10 or more) in Pyrocat - without a single emulsion defect.
    Since going back to the basics and meticulously developing film in trays exactly as Paula showed us during the workshop I haven't scratched a single sheet of Efke film.

  6. #16
    Flotsam's Avatar
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    I think that I have only processed Efke roll film and 35mm. The reels tend to protect the film through the process although I do give it a wipe before drying to remove the excess photo-flo. I never had an emulsion damage problem but switched to using a hardening developer after hearing all of the warnings.
    That is called grain. It is supposed to be there.
    =Neal W.=

  7. #17

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    I shot Efke PL100 8x10 exclusively for quite a while (probably 400 sheets) but ran into some serious quality control problems with two different batches of this film - namely uneven emulsion or some other defect in the emulsion that caused mottling or uneveness in the highlights. I have two colleagues who experienced the same phenomenon. The first time it happened, I chalked it up to a defective batch. However, it happened again about a year later and ruined many photographs from an extended trip to Death Valley so I swore off the stuff. J and C was aware of the problem, but Efke was unwilling to take any responsibility for it. Since then, I believe they have changed this film slightly. A friend who has used the "new" version has noted a change in development times. Otherwise, it was a great film. You can push it farther than any other film I've used without the highlights blocking up. Since then, I've been using Tri-X and have found it to be much more contrasty and unable to handle scenes with wide a tonal range as compared to PL100. However, like any film, they all have strengthes and weaknesses you can exploit if you take the time to learn how to get the most out of them.
    Scott Killian
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  8. #18
    c6h6o3's Avatar
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    My problem with PL100 is incredible fog. I ran out of 8x10 TMY and really can't afford to buy any for a while, so I've been using the last of a box of PL100 I bought two or three years ago. There is no expiry date on the box.

    I noted considerable fog in semi-stand negatives I made from this box of film for Steve Sherman's workshop in January of this year. I did one last night in Harvey's (semi-stand) and it's much worse. The edges look to be about Zone V.

    I'm wondering if DHS is x-raying the containers carrying this film when it's imported. My Efke seems to be deteriorating rapidly.

    I've always called it my second choice film after 400TMax because it's nearly as expandable, but any more buying Efke film seems to be like Forrest Gump's proverbial box of chocolates.

  9. #19
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    My understanding is that storage is an issue with some of these films and is the tradeoff for increased density range in films like Efke PL100 and J&C Classic (Fortepan) 400, so the base fog with age may just be normal. I try not to buy too much at a time.
    flickr--http://www.flickr.com/photos/davidagoldfarb/
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  10. #20
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    Although they are different films, in general I rate them at 1/2 box speed to get satifactory results with normal development times, with PMK. Satisfactory for me (YMMV), means a good dense neg with good contrast. The 25 tends to give more contrast than the others, so I tend use it more in low contrast situations.

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