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  1. #1

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    Ilfosol S & Pan F Air Bells probs

    Hi,

    I have never had probs with air bells causing patches where development does not occur, until now. I always rap the tank hard on a solid surface about 3 times after agitation. .....Never a problem. however with these two materials which I am currently honing, I am having problems.

    The air bells occur mostly along the margins (as you would expect) bit now that I am shooting some tests with a deep red, I can see that in the sky areas where density is low and continuous(filter..) I can clearly see the occassional bubble there too! I have also notices inexplicable uneven development here and there. I have developed thousands of rolls of film and thi s has never been a prob (dev times 1+14 are 8.5 mins so no issue there).

    I literally cannot bang the tank any harder without breaking the thing and am quite frustrated. I have tried 1+9, 1+14 and there is no change. The problem is the negs are lovely; crisp, great tonal range etc. This appears to be a show stopper.

    Is this particular to this combo or generally a problem with either of the two materials? I have to say, I have rolls of Pan F shot using the same combo about a year back when I first had try and NO PROBS. I cannot fathom why it has now reared its ugly head. The annoying thing is my first buch of rolls revealed nothing as the subjects had texture so I am finding this out many rolls down the road! I am glad no keepers have really been affected as I have been experimenting.

    I think I am going to test Pan F with Xtol (which I currenty have in) or Rodinal and see if it stil occurs. If it does, it will be the last time I use Pan F. Sods law clearly states that air bubbles will adhere to the best shots. I suspect it is something to do with this combo.

    Tom

  2. #2
    Rob Archer's Avatar
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    This I a combination I've had success with and never had a bubble problem. The only time I did (although not with this combo) was when I mixed dev with water straight from the tap and used it immediately. I suspect the water was highly aerated and the problem was solved by letting it stand for about 30 minutes. I can't think of anything else that would cause it.

    Rob

  3. #3

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    You'll find useful info here:

    http://wiki.silvergrain.org/wiki/index.php/Presoak

    All of my current film developers contain a small amount of water-soluble antifoaming agent and film-forming agent (makes even thin layer of developer when the film is above the surface of the solution during inversion) and their incorporation seems to be very useful in ensuring even development, even with reduced agitation.

  4. #4
    gainer's Avatar
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    I had some similar trouble with one of Kodaks T-grain films when it first came out. A drop or two of a wetting agent in the developer worked IIRC, but I don't remember which one. Probably a pre-soak with a couple of drops of almost any liquid dishwasher detergent added would do. They are designed not to foam.
    The good thing about getting old is you can't remember the bad things. The bad thing about it is you can't remember the good things.
    Gadget Gainer

  5. #5

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    I don't recommend adding any surfactant to the presoak or the developer. The anionic surfactants commonly used in high speed film coating have very strong foaming property and can't be defoamed by another low-foaming surfactant suych as ethoxylated alcohols. It's much better to simply rinse the film in plain water. (I've tried all sorts of things but the compound I mentioned above is not a surfactant.)

  6. #6

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    Thanks guys I might try a presoak and see if that helps the airbells and also try leaving the water to stand for a while before use. Now that you mention it the taps here are severly pressurised and the water comes out with a lot of air in it, but I then bottle it and use water that has had 24 hours to reach ambient temp. I use this bulk supply as it ensures constant temps for dev, stop fix etc. Maybe the capped bottles do not allow the dissolved air to escape?

    It could be the highly aerated water suppl. I have noticed pretty sever foaming but with all things being teh same have not had the probs with other devs.

    I now suspect something else it at play too (in addition to the obvious air bells). I noticed that in the uneven development, there were splotches of lower density AND higher density. I have used two batches of Pan F; the newer batch having no probs apart from air bells. The older batch has the splotches and of course air bells. I cannot say why, but I something about the splotches says 'fungus'. Cannot think how this would be possible considering the sealed plastic packets. The older film could be a year or so out of date....(not that this is normally an issue).



 

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